Forums > Queen - Serious Discussion > Why is no one else doing any studio wizardry anymore?

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reeddr user not visiting Queenzone.com

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Posted: 07 Jun 07, 18:53 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

Back in the 70's you had bands like Queen, Boston, Rush, etc that put out some very elaborate studio work which I have enjoyed very much. Now here we are in the 21st century and the studio technology has advanced by leaps and bounds, yet the recordings of today are very simple and basic. Why is no one putting together and creating any "Bo-Raps" of today?


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Posted: 07 Jun 07, 20:26 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

Most bands these days are a bunch of lazy slags who are uncreative. Music is going in a sad direction.....

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Posted: 07 Jun 07, 20:39 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

I'll say 1 band...THE KILLERS!

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Posted: 07 Jun 07, 21:05 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

DavidRFuller wrote:

Most bands these days are a bunch of lazy slags who are uncreative. Music is going in a sad direction.....



Thats just bullshit. There's a lot of great musical production out there, but the studio is used in a different way now. It's not worse or something, it's just different.

For example a lot of (good) rap music (like, for example Dr Dre's stuff) is produced really great. Don't forget it's not just a bunch of loops put together to make a song. It's actually choosing a sample, modifying, making new sounds et cetera.

It's not fair to say this is uninspired just because you don't like it.


"On the first day Pim & Niek created a heavenly occupation. Pim & Niek blessed it and named it 'Loosch'."



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Posted: 07 Jun 07, 22:40 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

You've got it all wrong. Songs are being made on laptops these days, not instruments. And with that, down goes creativity. Modifying and sampling, yes sheer genius. Moron.

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Posted: 08 Jun 07, 02:49 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

My personal point of view is that to produce (write music, put text, perform music, edit, record) something valuable, which does not have value only to you but also for other people requires intelligence. Oasis were just a school grades, so is Robbie Williams. I will not comment on rappers because most of them are practically illiterate. Freddie is brilliant because God kissed him on the brow with tallent but it was his sole responsibility to take care of this talent and he undertook it, moreso he undertook it in an intelligent way. That's the bitter truth - mediocrity rules the world nowadays, even within music!


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and we will all be turned to dust

your song shall never die!
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Posted: 08 Jun 07, 04:50 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

reeddr wrote:

Back in the 70's you had bands like Queen, Boston, Rush, etc that put out some very elaborate studio work which I have enjoyed very much. Now here we are in the 21st century and the studio technology has advanced by leaps and bounds, yet the recordings of today are very simple and basic. Why is no one putting together and creating any "Bo-Raps" of today?


I used to hate My Chemical Romance but their song 'Welcome To The Black Parade' is like a newer Bohemian Rhapsody. Gerard Way even said his influences are Queen. Next thing we know, he'll have a mustache!

Really though, I think of Welcome To The Black Parade as The Show Must Go On, Bohemian Rhapsody, and Innuendo all in one


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Posted: 08 Jun 07, 08:23 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

I think a lot of Queens music would have been better without the overproduction. I know it was their trademark, but often it was over done.

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Posted: 08 Jun 07, 08:31 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

Do we really need Studio wizardy? In my opinion, sometimes less is more!
Can you imagine QOTSA's "Songs for the Deaf" with a Roy-Thomas Baker like production? Believe it or not, even as a Queen Fan, the producers i like most are people like Kevin Shirley and Chris Goss. Especially Kevin Shirley, who let Led Zeppelin's "How the west was won" sound like it was recorded yesterday. Bonzo's Drums sound like REAL drums, not over-the-top effect loaded like Metallica's black album. To give a band a big sound, tons of effects and so on, is not a big deal. To let them sound like they are playin' in your living room, as natural as possible, that's real wizardy for me :-)

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Posted: 08 Jun 07, 08:53 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

DavidRFuller wrote:

You've got it all wrong. Songs are being made on laptops these days, not instruments. And with that, down goes creativity. Modifying and sampling, yes sheer genius. Moron.


You're ignorant


"On the first day Pim & Niek created a heavenly occupation. Pim & Niek blessed it and named it 'Loosch'."



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Posted: 08 Jun 07, 08:53 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

I don't see whats so hard about overdubbing 'thunderbold and lighting' 30 times, either. I don't see whats so genius about reversing the tape or using varispeed.


"On the first day Pim & Niek created a heavenly occupation. Pim & Niek blessed it and named it 'Loosch'."



(Genesis 1:1)
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Posted: 08 Jun 07, 11:05 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

I agree that rap, hip-hop and the like takes much less effort in the studio. Most of those genre is loops, samples and other auto-repetitive functions. I know a few in the recording business and they have told me that the ones who run the company love rap and hip hop because it's the least expensive style to produce which gives them the biggest profits. I also know a few older black studio musicians who lament that very few of black artists use real instruments anymore and the only time they get to play is on other genres. One stated "Look at the average hip-hop or R&B cd. You just see credits to 'programming' and like, almost never to folks playing real instruments. We don't have any new bands the likes of Earth Wind & Fire, Prince, etc making any serious dent in the music industry today"


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Posted: 08 Jun 07, 11:39 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

Everything takes less effort these days, and it winds up sounding shitty and computerized. Did they have these types of things in the 70's? No.

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Posted: 08 Jun 07, 11:55 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

I'm sure people in the 70's were also complaining that there wasn't enough brass in popular music. It's the time, everything changes. Move along or stop complaining.


"On the first day Pim & Niek created a heavenly occupation. Pim & Niek blessed it and named it 'Loosch'."



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Posted: 08 Jun 07, 12:14 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

People tend to undervalue everything modern, which is pathetic. There are wonderful productions in 2000's rap, pop, rock, jazz, classical, etc and some things are very difficult to be done "on laptops".

It's interesting that some have multiple orgasms if Pink Floyd or some contemporary act put an organ ostinato for twenty minutes doing the same bloody note, yet they complain if a 90's pop record's based on a drum+bass loop.

Very few things on prog rock are actually "studio wizardry". Just because modern artists use keyboards it doesn't make them lazy or mediocre.


John hated HS. Fred's fave singer was not PR. Roger didn't compose 'Innuendo.' Witness testimonies are often inaccurate. Scotland's not in England. 'Bo Rhap' hasn't got 180 voices.
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Posted: 08 Jun 07, 12:42 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

Sebastian wrote:

People tend to undervalue everything modern, which is pathetic. Just because modern artists use keyboards it doesn't make them lazy or mediocre.


Good point! Chemical Brothers for example are true artists. Just loops & programming you think? First, you need the right idea, second : get it all together! I messed around a while with Fruity loops, believe me, its harder than some of you may think!

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Posted: 08 Jun 07, 13:06 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

I am from the generation that should be listening to the wank thats around now and Generally there is no creativity, bare stripped back, caveman shite! weve gon backwards and I feel it my generations job to start bringing music forward again, were living in the limits of the 60's now as far as bands are concerned, lets bring back harmonies! And kill Indie!

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Posted: 08 Jun 07, 13:14 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

DavidRFuller wrote:

You've got it all wrong. Songs are being made on laptops these days, not instruments. And with that, down goes creativity. Modifying and sampling, yes sheer genius. Moron.


I would agree with this to some extent, e.g. the countless songs that sample snippets of old average songs which all the scallies then rave about, but some hip hop and sampling is really good.

Take DJ Shadow for example. He takes obscure samples and then masterfully combines them to produce a completely new song with its own personality and feeling. Check out Endtroducing, cracking album. And indeed, the Chemical Brothers are great.

Also, there are some albums that do use the studio to its capabilities. You should check out Six by Mansun, one of my favourite albums of all time and an overlooked masterpiece. It started life as a live guitar jam album but ended up being mixed completely out of control. Very few verse/chorus structures and lots of twists and changes.

The music is out there, its just few and far between and not the stuff that gets played mainstream. Finding it is more rewarding I think.


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Posted: 08 Jun 07, 13:34 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

Since this is a Queen forum, let's look at News Of The World. There isn't much studio wizardry on that one, if any at all.

But I'll definitely say this: Analog equipment has a much warmer sound to it. In the 80s, the shift began. If anyone's into AC/DC, compare the Highway To Hell album to Back In Black. Huge difference in sound quality.



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Posted: 08 Jun 07, 13:52 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

I think Queen, like the Beatles, used the studio like an instrument. And like any instrument,if you put it in the wrong hands, the results are going to be spotty. I think most bands are better off just sticking to guitars and drums. Not that there aren't good musicians any more, but I think to use the studio effectively it takes a visionary, and those are in short supply.