Forums > Queen - Serious Discussion > Doing The Archivist's Job For Him...

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Posted: 19 Feb 10, 20:07 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

I'm sorry if this one has already been done (it probably has in some form), but I'd be fascinated to read answers to the following question:

if anyone here had the chance to do Greg's job for a month, and think they could catalogue the material quicker or better than he has (is doing/ claims to have done) - and had access to the entire catalogue (this is all hypothetical, so you could include some tracks you think might exist, including victory, hangman, the gibb/stewart collaborations or even the best of the best bootlegs you have, regardless of quality) - how would you set about releasing the box set(s)?  What would the structure be? Tracklistings? I know that there is actually a similar thread by sithmaster34 somewhere, but I'd like to focus on the potential tracklistings and whether or not you'd have them run chronologically or grouped by album (i.e tracks that were thought of but re-worked later - would they be in by record date or by album order?) 

Please discuss.




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Posted: 19 Feb 10, 21:04 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

You're assuming that Greg has already put all this stuff in order, eh?

(I had written more, but I see you finally addressed, somewhat, the Victory issue in the other thread.)

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Posted: 19 Feb 10, 21:27 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote



 



Micrówave wrote:



You're assuming that Greg has already put all this stuff in order, eh?

And Thistleboy, you never answered ONE question about Victory, you ran away.  What's the deal?  What key was it in?  What was the song structure?  Was Steve Lukather the guitarist on Victory or did they use Michael Landau?

So instead of stirring up more shit, like you did in the previous thread you were in, you want to have a discussion defending The Queen Archivist?

No.  You said you've heard Victory a couple of times.  Answer the frickin questions!!!!   Don't hide behind "fear of QPL",  they could care less if you told us it was in the key of J.  And I doubt your "buddy-in-the-know" wouldn't stop playing you 20 year old tracks either.


Where did I intimate I assumed that he had put it together?  I think what I actually said was "has/is doing/ claims to have done". Where in this post am I defending GB?  I am asking if you had his "job" and could do it better, how would you do it?  The purpose of this is to find out what your ideas of the boxset would be - not to defend GB.  I've not even tried, nor am I going to try, to defend him.  In fact, he's an arrogant, useless cunt.  There.  As for running away - no!  Go back and read the thread again.  I don't see why I should crumble to your demands, but I have answered the questions as much as possible for the time I actually got with the tracks.  I'm not here to argue with you, Microwave, so stop trying to antagonise me.  I've already said I heard the stuff around 8 years ago and only once.  At that time, I was only too happy to be actually hearing the fabled FM/MJ collaborations to give a toss about who else played on it.  Also, I'm no musician, so I don't know what fucking key it was in.  Does it really matter? You're only going to argue, regardless of what I say - you do it with everybody, it's getting a little embarrassing.  I'm not here to stir shit either, I don't see why you could see this thread as stirring shit.  You are the one with the wooden spoon mate.  Your response had nothing whatsoever to do with the question, so either keep it on topic or shut up.  I'm sure I speak for the majority of QZers here on that one. 

Finally, where in your mind did you compute the reason I didn't originally say more was incase my buddy didn't play me any more tracks?  I simply didn't want to drop him in it by naming names, you've no idea of the experiences I've had with shit like this or just how much trouble it can cause.

If the answers I gave you in the RELEVANT thread are not enough, tough.  Just keep on wasting these forums with snide comments, you're only becoming a parody of yourself.

And since when was your job as a microwave a serious Queen discussion? 







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Posted: 19 Feb 10, 21:28 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

You edited before I replied, but the fact I pasted your rant this time shows just how unreasonable and frustrating you can be sometimes.  I do love you, though!


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Posted: 20 Feb 10, 10:11 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

Sorry, but when someone says they confirm the existance by saying the exact things that Greg said is also very frustrating, as others have pointed out.

Plus the fact that just you and I are speaking on this issue tells me that a lot of people here have had enough of the Queen Archivist and his bullshit posts.  Most could care less what is in the Queen Archives anymore... that's what we're trying to get across to him.   Time is running out.  The lifespan of Queen fans is running out.

Not that it would make or break me, but it would be nice to see a Queen product actually sell a few copies.  That hasn't happened in years.

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Posted: 20 Feb 10, 11:59 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote



Micrówave wrote:

Sorry, but when someone says they confirm the existance by saying the exact things that Greg said is also very frustrating, as others have pointed out.

Plus the fact that just you and I are speaking on this issue tells me that a lot of people here have had enough of the Queen Archivist and his bullshit posts.  Most could care less what is in the Queen Archives anymore... that's what we're trying to get across to him.   Time is running out.  The lifespan of Queen fans is running out.

Not that it would make or break me, but it would be nice to see a Queen product actually sell a few copies.  That hasn't happened in years.

It doesn't happen often, but on this point I fully agree with you Microwave.







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Posted: 20 Feb 10, 18:52 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

Thistleboy 1980: Are you sure you are not Greg in disguise?

But to answer your question...

First: Doing The Archivist's Job For Him... I don't think anyone would want such a negative job in the first place. Where is the personal creativity, the individuality, the job satisfaction?
Sure listening to music is fun, but to take that fun element away and turn it into cataloging every note and nuance is not as glamorous as it would seem. Very soon it would devolve into another slavish factory-type monotonous chore.

As they say - be careful what you wish for - as it may come true, and this sort of job is ceratinly up there with 'Dante's Inferno' and 'Doctor Faustus.

Second: It is impossible for us to say what we would release - as we do not have all the information available to make an informed or reasonable choice. What you would really have is a hypothetical answer to a hypothetical question - and as neither the answer or question have any merit - why discuss it in the first place?

Finally: nobody in Scotland actually supports Partick Thistle - do they?


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Posted: 20 Feb 10, 21:02 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

Good point on the last one.

Most add the word "offs" when referring to their nick name.

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Posted: 20 Feb 10, 22:02 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote



John S Stuart wrote:

Thistleboy 1980: Are you sure you are not Greg in disguise?

But to answer your question...

First: Doing The Archivist's Job For Him... I don't think anyone would want such a negative job in the first place. Where is the personal creativity, the individuality, the job satisfaction?
Sure listening to music is fun, but to take that fun element away and turn it into cataloging every note and nuance is not as glamorous as it would seem. Very soon it would devolve into another slavish factory-type monotonous chore.

As they say - be careful what you wish for - as it may come true, and this sort of job is ceratinly up there with 'Dante's Inferno' and 'Doctor Faustus.

Second: It is impossible for us to say what we would release - as we do not have all the information available to make an informed or reasonable choice. What you would really have is a hypothetical answer to a hypothetical question - and as neither the answer or question have any merit - why discuss it in the first place?

Finally: nobody in Scotland actually supports Partick Thistle - do they?


Firstly, am I Greg? Does that really need answering? You know I'm not.  If I was, I wouldn't have the want to be the Queen "archivist".  I'd already have that job.

Secondly, it may all just be hypothetical, but I don't know half of the stuff people know (or claim to know) exists.  I stopped searching years ago, but have found my interest is sparking up a little more now and want to know about the tracks I've maybe not heard could be/are around.  I thought this might be a way of doing that.  As you are more in the know, and have something that even the band say didn't get recorded (Hangman), it may not have merit to you, but it may to others (why else would there be debates over next possible releases if topics like this have no merit?)  - so if you're not interested in the topic, then your contribution was more pointless than you say the actual thread is.  It's hypothetical, yes, but for a pleb like me, quite interesteing to hear the thoughts of other fans and collectors.  If you think it's inane, then I'm sure a man of your intellect would know just to let it die out.

Finally, if no-one else in Scotland supports Partick Thistle, I do - so yes, someone is Scotland does.  And there's more chance of them winning the Champions League as there is you own an acetate of hangman, btw.






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Posted: 21 Feb 10, 02:42 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

You guys seem to think that it is up to Greg what is and is not released from the Queen archives. This has all been discussed many times here on Moanzone and attacking Greg will not get anything released now or in the future as it is solely down to the band what will see the light of day.
Obviously Brian and Roger are not in Queen mode at the moment what with books and solo material on their minds. They have just done a Queen project and promoted it well I think with Absolute Greatest, and in their minds it is time to move on to other things. That might not suit you or me or anybody else, but it is their decision.
You can suggest, wish, beg or even go cap in hand to QPL for what you wish to be issued from the archives but if one of the guys doesn't think they want you to hear a particular demo or footage from Paris in 1979, then you never will.
We all have 37 years of recorded studio material, numerous live audio tapes and video footage and a wealth of solo and collaboration stuff that we can listen to again and again at any time we want to.....and this is the top class stuff the band want you to hear.....the band at their best.

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Posted: 21 Feb 10, 04:15 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

Obviously it's not up to Greg, I doubt Queen even knows him by name.

I'm sure QPL has come to the realization that they don't have much life left.  Sure, they can sell their material for advertisement or hope for a movie or TV show to feature one of their songs, but that's about it.  It's downright embarrassing to even look at the Queen Section anymore.  Nothing sells.  Absolute Greatest was a flop.  The Cosmos Rocks Limited LP Box was a flop.  The Singles Collections were a flop.  Queen is down to what Lynyrd Skynyrd is down to... releasing compilation albums and hoping for the best.  It's only a matter of time before we start seeing the $7.99 collections.

Even the Queenzone members whose houses I'd love to break into are starting to enrich the pages of Ebay.

So what little "gold" they have left will remain in the vaults as their "last ditch effort".  Once that's released, good night QPL.  I wouldn't release it either.

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Posted: 21 Feb 10, 05:06 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote



Micrówave wrote:

Obviously it's not up to Greg, I doubt Queen even knows him by name.

I'm sure QPL has come to the realization that they don't have much life left.  Sure, they can sell their material for advertisement or hope for a movie or TV show to feature one of their songs, but that's about it.  It's downright embarrassing to even look at the Queen Section anymore.  Nothing sells.  Absolute Greatest was a flop.  The Cosmos Rocks Limited LP Box was a flop.  The Singles Collections were a flop.  Queen is down to what Lynyrd Skynyrd is down to... releasing compilation albums and hoping for the best.  It's only a matter of time before we start seeing the $7.99 collections.

Even the Queenzone members whose houses I'd love to break into are starting to enrich the pages of Ebay.

So what little "gold" they have left will remain in the vaults as their "last ditch effort".  Once that's released, good night QPL.  I wouldn't release it either.

at least skynyrd managed a new studio album and tour








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Posted: 21 Feb 10, 05:28 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote



 



GT wrote:



You guys seem to think that it is up to Greg what is and is not released from the Queen archives.


Keep repeating a lie and hope it becomes the truth? No one thinks it's up to him. He gets abuse because he comes across  as a complete tosser. Having said that, compared to some the freaks, homophobes, and racists currently ocupying Queenzone, he is positively saintly. (please note, those last few words must never be quoted out of context ;)








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Posted: 21 Feb 10, 07:09 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote































Why the need for the two-smokin' barrels? No need for hostility. We are all friends in here.
























Thistleboy 1980 wrote:





























Firstly, am I Greg? Does that really need answering? You know I'm not.  If I was, I wouldn't have the want to be the Queen "archivist".  I'd already have that job.

I have no idea who you are. How the Henry Hall would I know?
You are the one who intimates we are all liars - so using your logic - to deny you are the archivist - sounds very much
like something he would say!.

So moving away from the Thistleboy 1980 mask, I know all the 'big hitters' in Scotland. You don't seem to be anyone I
know. (I know I don't know 'every' Queen fan in Scotland - but finding someone who claims to has both heard the 'Victory'
track - and - live in this small area is a bit of a double coincidence).

So why not PM me? If I do know you - let's introduce ourselves to each other where we can talk man to man.
If you don't want to know me - that is fine too.
But please do not come in here, hiding behind a pseudonym, and knock the reputations of people you do not know,
or would not even recogize if they stood next to you in a queue.
You are not omnipotent, and in the words of Charlie Rich; 'No one knows what goes on behind closed doors'.

I am proud of my name. My name is my reputation. I hide not behind a mask of mystery.
People accept me for who I am - because of my past track record.
Like a contestant on a pub-quiz team, I am chosen because people can judge me from previous results.
They know I can deliver.
In otherwords I am on the team in merit - not charity.

What have you ever delivered?
What have you ever done that is verifiable?

As you are more in the know, and have something that even the band say didn't get recorded (Hangman), it may
not have merit to you, but it may to others... It's hypothetical, yes, but for a pleb like me, quite interesteing to hear
the thoughts of other fans and collectors. 


Good point, well made. Perhaps I deserved that one.
(Still no need for the two smokin' barrels though!)
But my reply was not out of arrogance, rather it was born from...

1: The previous amount of times we have discussed this at Moanzone, and for old timers like me - it really has
been flogged to death. (A quick use of the search function should reveal tons of info on this line).
Perhaps I should have given a bit more latitude to a newbie, but then again, any newbie who has heard 'Victory'
also has a lot to bring to the table.
So what else have you heard - that you can talk about?
(Are you sure you are not Greg? The concept of information being a one-way street seems vaguely familiar somehow).

2: The frustration of knowing that if 'Victory' does exist - it will still not see the light of day.
This, to me,  is again playing into the hands of the buy sh*te now - reward in heaven policy - which I flatly refuse
to subscribe to. Buy all the crap you wish - with my blessing - but there will be no 'Victory' celebration (if you excuse the
pun). at the end of it. It is all a ruse to keep the masses opiated.

...there's more chance of them winning the Champions League as there is you own an acetate of hangman, btw.

100% certain are we?
How do you know that for sure?

I have always been 100% honest with the community.
(I think Ruth said 99.999% in another thread).
Judge me on my works, my deeds, my actions...
Some say actions talk louder than words.

My words are crisp, clear and unambiguious. So I will say this once and for all...

I own 'Hangman' 10" x one-sided EMI actete.

You can read about it - in here - in detail - in moanzone (an exclusive if you like).
I can't be ars*d finding the thread ATM, but I am sure you will that it is still there.

If this contradicts Brian's recollections, then I am sure that others in here (Sebastian springs to mind) who can confirm
(with evidence) Dr. May's amazing ability to forget things, to lose track of time, to lose track of songs (and even the
albums they appear on). Which just goes to show he is human - and not a computer after all.

Remember - much of the debut album was bounced between studios.
Many different places - at many different times.
Lots of physical movement. Lots of moving equipment.
Who could blame them if they lost a few bits along the way?

But to claim it does not exist...

As for Partick Thistle and the Champions league...













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Posted: 21 Feb 10, 14:56 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

It stated in the index Thistle boy replied.
But where has that post gone?


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Posted: 21 Feb 10, 15:11 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote



 



John S Stuart wrote:



It stated in the index Thistle boy replied.
But where has that post gone?



Hi, I noticed that - I tried posting again and exactly the same thing happened - so, if it appears twice, it's not because I'm trying to spam.

In case it doesn't re-appear, here is what I wrote:

OK Mr. Stuart, I agree that there was absolutely no need for the hostility (hindsight is a great thing, but I did take your response as complete arrogance and found it patronising on first glance).  I hope you accept fully my  sincerest aplogies for that and for the hangman dig, which I am quite sure you are telling the truth about, as obviously I have heard about you and your contributions - it was a tit for tat response to your Partick Thistle jibe, a little childish and I'm big enough to admit that.  Hopefully, we can start again.

Firstly, no - you don't know me.  My name is James Gilchrist.  I am 30 years old , live in Glasgow and have been a Queen fan since MIH in 1995. I support Partick Thistle (I've got the tattoo to prove it, lol) and work for a music shop.  I am reasonably knowlegable in the field, but  I DO NOT have the wealth of experience you have and am not one of the "big hitters" as you put it.  I was, admittedly, a stepford who would hoard anything I could and would trawl around out-dated websites believing all the hearsay they spouted.  I used to trade whatever boots I had for something better and always found it allowed me to get whatever demos were around at the time - truth be told, I've not had anything "new" that way since the first couple of FM/MJ tracks leaked or the 7 Hot Space ones at the time.  Anything I've heard since has been recorded at conventions, is shit quality and has the "property of...." lines throughout, nothing I'd want to have a copy of.

The guy who played me "victory" all that time ago may have been a "big hitter" at the time and maybe it was just plain fluke that I came to know him.  You probably know him too, some of you here actually do as I've read so, but I'm still not naming him publically.  I'm no longer in contact with the guy, that was eight years ago and it was probably a big fluke also that he hapened to play me the tracks.  Maybe he was just showing off, maybe he was just too excited about them or maybe he's just so clever he put them together himself (although fuck know how, as explained in the relevant thread).  It's done and dusted, and you're right - we can hope, speculate, argue, do whatever we want to - it won't see the light of day and no-one will actually know the truth on the matter.

"victory"  is the only thing I've heard that doesn't seem to have circulated, so I've nothing else to talk about regarding demos -  I'm sorry I can't verify it to your satisfaction, I can't really elaborate any further, so it's dead in the water. So that's why I was hoping for some response on this thread, in order to find out more about other demos/out-takes which exist and are in circulation.  If you recall, I had already started the topic by saying I was sorry if it had already been done.  And I'll still stand by my view that if you don't care, don't respond - that's what's turning this into "moanzone".

To be honest, I couldn't give a monkey's about what the general public opinion is of the merits of the set, and I agree that it is up to Queen to put it out, or not, but I just wanted to know a little more about what was out there.  Like I said, I had lost all interest in collecting for such a long while, so I'm WAY behing now on what's happening, especially since I'm not in contact with the only one who seemed to be getting anything "new".

The things I don't know about interest me greatly and I still get excited about finding or receiving "new" Queen material, even if it is just old rope to you.  So that's about it.  And just because I've only recently began posting on QZ doesn' exactly make me a "newbie", I've been subscribing (on and off) since 1999.

Finally - we are all friends in here?  I'd like to think so (and hope that we can be, John).

No more smokin' barrells, lol







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Posted: 21 Feb 10, 15:54 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

Thistleboy 1980: Civilised, courteous, and the ability to hold down an interesting conversation?

OK. I am convinced. Your not Greg afterall[img=/images/smiley/msn/thumbs_up.gif][/img]


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Posted: 21 Feb 10, 16:21 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

"Michael Jackson tracks: Greg is positive that the tracks will eventually
appear on a CD in some form, there is 1 track in the Queen
archives: VICTORY,
but they aren't allowed yet to release it! the track has all the
queen boys singing backing vocals!"

http://www.brianmay.com/queen/convention2001/gregbrooks.html

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Posted: 21 Feb 10, 17:12 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote































GT wrote:















We all have 37 years of recorded studio material, numerous live audio tapes and video footage and a wealth of solo and collaboration stuff that we can listen to again and again at any time we want to.....and this is the top class stuff the band want you to hear.....the band at their best.














I generally agree with your post, except for this part I've highlighted.

From what I know exists.. Hammersmith 75, Earls Court 77, Houston 77, and Los Angeles 77 have not been released.  What has been released so far is great, but overall, the live material available for the public to hear is far from their best and does not represent the full picture of what Queen were about as a live band.

Something is definitely wrong when the majority of the best live material available to hear has come from the fans and not the band.



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Posted: 21 Feb 10, 17:45 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

Whatever happened to Bob's post?
(OK - sorry - it's re-appeared)


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