Forums > Queen - Serious Discussion > Re-Releases = Rip Off?

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ct0409 user not visiting Queenzone.com

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Posted: 21 Jul 11, 16:02 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

Does anyone else feel a little cheated?
We are expected to buy the CDs again (after having bought the remasters a few years back) and are treated to only a few bonustracks that mostly are..well, not so impressive. Instrumental remixes, really? At least have the decency and put everything from that era on the disc and give some value for the money! (For example: where is Hangman?) 

This wasn´t for the fans! Don´t Brian and Roger have a say in what gets done with their legacy? Or do they no loger care?


CT
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Posted: 21 Jul 11, 16:40 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

Not worthy of a response....

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Posted: 21 Jul 11, 16:42 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

ct0409 wrote: Does anyone else feel a little cheated?
We are expected to buy the CDs again (after having bought the remasters a few years back) and are treated to only a few bonustracks that mostly are..well, not so impressive. Instrumental remixes, really? At least have the decency and put everything from that era on the disc and give some value for the money! (For example: where is Hangman?) 

This wasn´t for the fans! Don´t Brian and Roger have a say in what gets done with their legacy? Or do they no loger care?

I feel cheated for several reasons. I bought most of the original albums on vinyl, cassette, and the Hollywood Records remasters 20 years ago, which, if done properly, I wouldn't have to replace. Also, here in the US not only do we have to wait an additional three months, but we also have to pay $16 USD  for the two CD set. Not choice here to buy a single disc. I agree this wasn't for the fans. QPL has exhibited much contempt for fans over the years, and this is further proof. Putting previously released live tracks as bonuses is a joke. These reissues are intended to snag new listeners....but from the sales of the first 5 on Amazon US, that  isn't happening. We need BBC complete and we need the oft-named 70s bootlegs out in remastered form. One has only to look to the recent Pink Floyd immersion discs to realize how this should have been done.

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Posted: 21 Jul 11, 19:49 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

its at least the 3rd time these albums have been remastered (EMI and Hollywood previously) and it does appear that mainly the bonus tracks on universal are a disappointment with so many tracks being live versions which are already on existing releases. Sure stuff like Feelings, Feelings are good but it does stink of a rip off. I have some of the Holywood releases like ADATR and The Works which have  decent remixes or some awful ones in the case of bicycle race and rick rubins wwry. I think most fans would prefer an antholgy of alt versions and unreleased stuff, for example an album of the BBC 77 stuff would have been better but why buy the albums yet again? if you really want the bonus tracks just download em off i tunes. As for Deep Cuts these are a waste of time too like absolute greatest. To be honest, after NOTW Queen didnt produce an album which I enjoy from start to finish without skipping at least two or three songs.


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Posted: 21 Jul 11, 20:21 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

I feel somewhat ripped off, and I will feel more ripped off when I buy the 2nd box of 5 albums, as the cost has gone up almost 15% ($10) versus the first box set.  I am hoping the cost will drop below $75 before the Sept 13th release day.  Oh well, Queen guessed the price of my soul.


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Posted: 21 Jul 11, 21:29 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

I don't feel ripped off at all, mainly because I never feel particularly entitled. I bought the 1991 HR remasters back in the day because they came out just as I got into Queen. They sounded good and and aside from a few of the infamous HR glitches, I believe they sound pretty good. Sure, we could (and have) debate the merits of the various remasters, but I have no complaints about the quality of these.

That was 20 years ago and I felt I may as well update the remasters with the 2011 editions and get the bonus tracks. I'm not too interested in the live tracks from Wembley, Montreal and Milton Keynes, but whatever, I guess they're trying advertise the live albums. However, that's the seasoned fan in me talking. These releases seem to try to balance an appeal to both new and old fans, but naturally your mileage may vary on how successful they are.

My lack of feeling entitled allows me to pick and chose those releases I want to pay for. If the 2011 remasters didn't have bonus tracks, I might not have bought them. Were Queen buying my fandom? No. There was an incentive added and I choose to take advantage of it. I didn't buy the Singles Collections mainly because of the price tag and the track selection. Nor did I buy each remasters series as it came out.

Do I wish for more unreleased material? Heck yeah, but I don't feel betrayed when it remains unreleased.

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Posted: 22 Jul 11, 00:02 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

I don't really have to explain this, but it's not a rip-off.  When you look at something - for argument's sake, these reissues - you do a quick mental calculation of how much you want it vs. whether or not you think it is priced decently.  If you buy it, you've accepted the price of the thing, and it is your fault for buying it.  Or, you think it's too expensive, and you don't buy it - therefore you keep your money and no one has ripped you off.

There really isn't any such thing as a rip-off.  Take it or leave it, and if you're too cheap - just download the cunting thing ....


"Your not funny, your not a good musician, theres a difference between being funny and being an idiot, you obviously being the latter" - Dave R Fuller
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Posted: 22 Jul 11, 00:12 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

Zebonka12 wrote: I don't really have to explain this, but it's not a rip-off.  When you look at something - for argument's sake, these reissues - you do a quick mental calculation of how much you want it vs. whether or not you think it is priced decently.  If you buy it, you've accepted the price of the thing, and it is your fault for buying it.  Or, you think it's too expensive, and you don't buy it - therefore you keep your money and no one has ripped you off.

There really isn't any such thing as a rip-off.  Take it or leave it, and if you're too cheap - just download the cunting thing .... -----------------
..........
Exactly.

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Posted: 22 Jul 11, 00:49 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

I bought the re-re-re-re-re-re-re-re-re-re-re-releases ONLY for the bonus discs. I didn't even listen to the most of the main discs ( I listened only to Queen 2, Opera and Jazz) and I don't plan to listen to them in the near future. But I must say that the songs / albums which I DID listen to are way too loud for me, so I'm keeping my EMI + Japan remasters

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Posted: 22 Jul 11, 01:09 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

It is not the price mainly that angers me (though 21 Euros is quite a lot), but the sheer lack of consideration when putting those new editions out: Why not give a more appropriate Bonus-Content. Who cares for an Instrumental Remix when songs like Hangman are not included? Live tracks are a nice edition, but putting on only 10 min instead of an hour is just cheating, considering they have 100 cds worth of quality recordings in the vault.

That leads to the real question: When will the real interesting stuff finally be released?


CT
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Posted: 22 Jul 11, 01:59 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

What frustrates me is the fact this is supposed to be Queen's 40th Anniversary this year,and so far all we have to show for the 'celebrations' is an exibition called Stormtroopers in Stilettos and a re re re release of material that is already available.Its 7 months into the year now.Where are the 'Many surprises' we were promised????????????

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Posted: 22 Jul 11, 03:02 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

They're probably aiming at the Christmas market if there are big-ticket items planned.

As to the issue of re-re-re-re-issues, I think the complaints how many there were get a bit overblown. Each was aimed at a different market and territory:

1991 Hollywood Records (US)
Queen to The Miracle

1994 EMI Digital Master Series (UK)
Queen to The Works

1998 Crown Jewels (Hollywood Records - US)
Queen to The Game

2004 EMI-Japan Mini-LP replicas (Japan)
Queen to Made In Heaven

2011 Universal & Hollywood Records (Worldwide)
Queen to Made In Heaven

And that's not accounting for the one-offs like 30th Anniversary Edition of Opera and the Mobile Fidelity Sound Labs CDs. Queen and Queen Productions are not directly responsible for all these. The record companies, working individually, commission the remasters for sale in their respective territories, as per their licensing with QPL. They agree to promote the band and do so according to those terms. The key to understanding why there were 5 sets in 20 years is that the territories do not often cross-pollinate their releases at the management level, or sometimes even at the distributor level, making it hard for one territory to import from another. And that can vary from store to store. And the record companies depend on that in order to make their release the primary sale item. 

If anything, QPL and Queen themselves are doing the world a favour by standardizing the current releases and making them available worldwide through Universal. The company out of step now is Hollywood Records, ironically, because they are not currently carrying Deep Cuts 1 and the 2011 remaster of Greatest Hits 1. I can't explain the absence of DC1, but GH1 not getting a US release probably has to do with HR still issuing the red GH and GH-WWRY Edition, not to mention Absolute Greatest, Stone Cold Classics, Classic Queen and The A To Z Of Queen. If that's the case, I think HR has reached a point where it needs to seriously re-think the many Hits and Best Of collections it markets. Until now, I was fine with the choices, and still am in theory (give casual fans a few items to pick from, for sure), but if it actually precludes us from getting a release we want domestically, there's a problem.

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Posted: 22 Jul 11, 04:22 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

I don't feel ripped off at all, because I haven't wasted my money on the things.

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Posted: 22 Jul 11, 04:24 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

As a life long Queen fan I've learnt never expect suprises. However I have seen a few quotes that Roger and Brian are planning to play some live shows???? if it happens would be great but if not it wouldnt be a suprised as it seems to be the run of the mill over the last few years rumour after rumour, such and such is gonna play a few dates with his soul brother (RT and Taylor Hawkins), solo albums etc. Then we get PR raising his head again (kerchiiiing)

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Posted: 22 Jul 11, 06:28 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

rhyeking - the Japanese vinyl replicas were released in 2001. The 2004 edition has the same audio content, but it comes in standard CD cases

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Posted: 22 Jul 11, 07:08 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

The only problem with the reissues are they are trying to cater for everyone and truely serving no one. A real shame, but I've been very happy with them. The combined bonus material is a stunning anthology.

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Posted: 22 Jul 11, 08:49 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

It is a rip off when you consider ANATO being identical to the 2005 (apart from a small cleaning of bo rhap).
To me, that is dishonest to all those 2005 ANATO owners.
The remastering is still not definitive, bonus material is patchy.
If I was in the greatest band of all time and had plenty of spare time and didn't need cash, I'd take care to make sure my legacy was released the best it could be. But then again, plenty of badgers and foxes might die in the process.

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Posted: 22 Jul 11, 09:50 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

Do I think they are a rip-off?  Probably. 

I haven't bought any of them because, I guess, I don't really want them.


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Posted: 22 Jul 11, 10:31 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

pittrek wrote: rhyeking - the Japanese vinyl replicas were released in 2001. The 2004 edition has the same audio content, but it comes in standard CD cases
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Isn't it the other way around?

I own the Greatest Hits 1 from the EMI-Toshiba 'Queen Digital Remasters' series, dated on the CD as 2001 and on the sleeve as '01-11-21' (November 21st, 2001).

I don't own any of the mini-LPs, but when I look them up they consistently are advertised as 2004 releases, including Amazon Japan:

http://www.amazon.co.jp

and the Queen Vault:

http://www.queenvault.com/madeinheavenalbum.html

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Posted: 22 Jul 11, 11:22 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

A genuine "rip-off" happens when something is advertised as one thing, inducing you to buy it, and when you get it, you find out its less than what it was promised to be. That's a real "rip-off".

If you spend money on something knowing exactly what you're getting and you don't like it, that's not a "rip-off" - that's buyer's remorse and that's your fault.

If you are disappointed that something isn't what you wished it were before you ever buy it, and yet you still buy it solely for the sake of being able to say you were "ripped-off", you're mental or childishly irrational.

If you don't like the looks of something and use rational decision making and don't buy it, you haven't been "ripped-off" because you're not out anything.

A lot of you who cry "rip-off" are incorrectly using the word as a shorthand way of saying "I want more unreleased Queen material I have never had access to before and no one's putting it in a shop for me to buy and its making me mad" - and that's fine, but don't call it a "rip-off", because it isn't.


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