Forums > Queen - Serious Discussion > lossy or lossless?

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bootLuca user not visiting Queenzone.com
bootLuca
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Posted: 16 Sep 11, 16:27 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

I have checked the audio from the dvd of the first night in wembley 86 and this is what audiochecker says about the stereo track:

01 -=- 01 - One Vision.wav -=- MPEG (95%)
02 -=- 02 - Tie Your Mother Down.wav -=- MPEG (95%)
03 -=- 03 - In The Lap Of The Gods Revisited.wav -=- CDDA (100%)
04 -=- 04 - Seven Seas Of Rhye.wav -=- CDDA (99%)
05 -=- 05 - Tear It Up.wav -=- MPEG (95%)
06 -=- 06 - A kind Of Magic.wav -=- MPEG (95%)
07 -=- 07 - Under Pressure.wav -=- MPEG (95%)
08 -=- 08 - Another One Bites The Dust.wav -=- MPEG (95%)
09 -=- 09 - Who Wants To Live Forever.wav -=- MPEG (95%)
10 -=- 10 - I Want To Break Free.wav -=- MPEG (95%)
11 -=- 11 - Impromptu.wav -=- CDDA (100%)
12 -=- 12 - Brighton Rock Solo.wav -=- CDDA (100%)
13 -=- 13 - Now I'm Here.wav -=- MPEG (95%)
14 -=- 14 - Love Of My Life.wav -=- CDDA (100%)
15 -=- 15 - Is This The World We Created.wav -=- CDDA (100%)
16 -=- 16 - (You're So Square) Baby I Don't Care.wav -=- CDDA (100%)
17 -=- 17 - Hello Mary Lou (Goodbye Heart).wav -=- CDDA (100%)
18 -=- 18 - Tutti Frutti.wav -=- MPEG (95%)
19 -=- 19 - Bohemian Rhapsody.wav -=- MPEG (95%)
20 -=- 20 - Hammer To Fall.wav -=- MPEG (95%)
21 -=- 21 - Crazy Little Thing Called Love.wav -=- MPEG (95%)
22 -=- 22 - Radio Ga Ga.wav -=- MPEG (95%)
23 -=- 23 - We Will Rock You.wav -=- MPEG (95%)
24 -=- 24 - Friends Will Be Friends.wav -=- MPEG (95%)
25 -=- 25 - We Are The Champions.wav -=- MPEG (95%)
26 -=- 26 - God Save The Queen.wav -=- CDDA (100%)

bootLuca user not visiting Queenzone.com
bootLuca
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Posted: 16 Sep 11, 16:29 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

and this about the DTS track

01 -=- 01 - One Vision.wav -=- CDDA (100%)
02 -=- 02 - Tie Your Mother Down.wav -=- CDDA (100%)
03 -=- 03 - In The Lap Of The Gods Revisited.wav -=- CDDA (100%)
04 -=- 04 - Seven Seas Of Rhye.wav -=- CDDA (100%)
05 -=- 05 - Tear It Up.wav -=- CDDA (99%)
06 -=- 06 - A kind Of Magic.wav -=- MPEG (95%)
07 -=- 07 - Under Pressure.wav -=- MPEG (95%)
08 -=- 08 - Another One Bites The Dust.wav -=- MPEG (95%)
09 -=- 09 - Who Wants To Live Forever.wav -=- MPEG (95%)
10 -=- 10 - I Want To Break Free.wav -=- MPEG (95%)
11 -=- 11 - Impromptu.wav -=- MPEG (95%)
12 -=- 12 - Brighton Rock Solo.wav -=- MPEG (95%)
13 -=- 13 - Now I'm Here.wav -=- CDDA (100%)
14 -=- 14 - Love Of My Life.wav -=- MPEG (95%)
15 -=- 15 - Is This The World We Created.wav -=- MPEG (95%)
16 -=- 16 - (You're So Square) Baby I Don't Care.wav -=- MPEG (95%)
17 -=- 17 - Hello Mary Lou (Goodbye Heart).wav -=- MPEG (95%)
18 -=- 18 - Tutti Frutti.wav -=- CDDA (100%)
19 -=- 19 - Bohemian Rhapsody.wav -=- MPEG (95%)
20 -=- 20 - Hammer To Fall.wav -=- CDDA (99%)
21 -=- 21 - Crazy Little Thing Called Love.wav -=- CDDA (100%)
22 -=- 22 - Radio Ga Ga.wav -=- CDDA (100%)
23 -=- 23 - We Will Rock You.wav -=- CDDA (100%)
24 -=- 24 - Friends Will Be Friends.wav -=- CDDA (100%)
25 -=- 25 - We Are The Champions.wav -=- CDDA (100%)
26 -=- 26 - God Save The Queen.wav -=- MPEG (95%)

what do you think?for me it's really strange that some tracks are CDDA and other are MPEG sourced...

brENsKi user not visiting Queenzone.com
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brENsKi
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Posted: 16 Sep 11, 16:34 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

could the software be mis-reporting it?
or, did queen mistakenly use the (lossy)  bootleg audio off their own QOL downloads?


go deo na hÉireann
bootLuca user not visiting Queenzone.com
bootLuca
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Posted: 16 Sep 11, 17:05 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

I'm working with Audiochecker release 2.0.0.457 Beta...I don't know if this beta version change something.....

Battler user not visiting Queenzone.com

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Posted: 16 Sep 11, 21:09 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

Actually, the LPCM 2-channel track takes 1300918272 bytes, which is more than the 1249408364 bytes it takes when converted to normal PCM WAVe. Lossy? Definitely not, at least for the 2-channel track. The 6-channel DTS track, however, is very compressed, as there's no way it takes 3 times the space the 2-channel track takes, or else the audio alone would take more space than both audio tracks+video take.

And how the checker verifies individual tracks, when the disc is split among a few sections each lasting a few tracks, so each is bound to he encoded the same way. And if the total is bigger than raw WAVe, then I don't see where the loss is. ;)

bootLuca user not visiting Queenzone.com
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Posted: 17 Sep 11, 00:01 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

ok,

and this is the GHII results

Path: ...\1991 - Greatest Hits II

001 -=- 01 - A Kind Of Magic.wav -=- MPEG (95%)
002 -=- 02 - Under Pressure.wav -=- CDDA (100%)
003 -=- 03 - Radio Ga Ga.wav -=- CDDA (100%)
004 -=- 04 - I Want It All.wav -=- CDDA (99%)
005 -=- 05 - I Want To Break Free.wav -=- CDDA (100%)
006 -=- 06 - Innuendo.wav -=- CDDA (100%)
007 -=- 07 - It's A Hard Life.wav -=- CDDA (100%)
008 -=- 08 - Breakthru.wav -=- CDDA (100%)
009 -=- 09 - Who Wants To Live Forever.wav -=- CDDA (100%)
010 -=- 10 - Headlong.wav -=- CDDA (100%)
011 -=- 11 - The Miracle.wav -=- CDDA (100%)
012 -=- 12 - I'm Going Slightly Mad.wav -=- CDDA (100%)
013 -=- 13 - The Invisible Man.wav -=- CDDA (100%)
014 -=- 14 - Hammer To Fall.wav -=- CDDA (100%)
015 -=- 15 - Friends Will Be Friends.wav -=- CDDA (100%)
016 -=- 16 - The Show Must Go On.wav -=- CDDA (100%)
017 -=- 17 - One Vision.wav -=- CDDA (100%)

master marathon runner user not visiting Queenzone.com
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Posted: 17 Sep 11, 04:23 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

EH?

.

.MASTER MARATHON RUNNER


Master Marathon Runner
bootLuca user not visiting Queenzone.com
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Posted: 17 Sep 11, 06:31 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

yes, the new gh2 2011 remaster japanese edition...

pittrek user not visiting Queenzone.com
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Posted: 17 Sep 11, 06:34 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

DTS is of course lossy, but the PCM is lossless (unless they started with a lossy digital source of course)

master marathon runner user not visiting Queenzone.com
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Posted: 17 Sep 11, 08:38 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

DOUBLE EH?

.
.
MASTER MARATHON RUNNER


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thomasquinn 32989 user not visiting Queenzone.com
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Posted: 17 Sep 11, 09:56 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

pittrek wrote: unless they started with a lossy digital source of course
=====

Quite possible. Or perhaps the original tapes constitute a comparatively inferior quality recording (compared to current-day recordings), which gives a 'false positive' as MPEG on modern software? Mixing and mastering for vinyl records does not work in exactly the same way as digital mixing and mastering, after all, and the quality of the final product depends on different variables for respective vinyl and digital recordings. Some songs may have cuts in the spectrum resembling MPEG, for instance.


Not Plutus but Apollo rules Parnassus

Negative Creep user not visiting Queenzone.com

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Posted: 17 Sep 11, 16:22 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

I've ripped the Friday night PCM audio to 16 bit 48khz WAV files using DVD Audio Extractor. There is no frequency cut off, it goes all the way up to 24 khz - I doubt it is lossy. It could potentially be AAC sourced, but it's hard to tell since none of those programs detect decent AAC as lossy and the actually recording is heavily processed with compression and heavy de-essing on Freddie's vocals. I've tested One Vision with Audio Checker, and it came back as 100% "CDDA", so not sure what bootLuca is doing.

"Mixing and mastering for vinyl records does not work in exactly the same way as digital mixing and mastering"

Regardless of whether that statement is true or not, how is this relevant? This is a freshly digitally mixed recording, taken from a high resolution digital transfer of the multitracks. Mixed and mastered for digital release no less.

Wilki Amieva user not visiting Queenzone.com
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Posted: 17 Sep 11, 21:36 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

The truth is... AudioChecker is a joke!

Flavus user not visiting Queenzone.com

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Posted: 19 Sep 11, 06:59 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

Audiochecker is, I'm afraid, full of shit.

It just told me that Track 5 of my father in law's Andrea Bocelli CD is 99% an MPEG.  Two other tracks are only 99% and 92% CCDA.

Bullshit.

bootLuca user not visiting Queenzone.com
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Posted: 19 Sep 11, 07:51 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

are there other ways to check the source of an cd?

Negative Creep user not visiting Queenzone.com

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Posted: 19 Sep 11, 08:02 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

None of the tracks are flagged up in Audio Checker as being anything other than 100% CD Audio and the frequencies don't cut out to suggest anything other than high res audio - so what are you still going on about?