Forums > Queen - Serious Discussion > Mixed thoughts on 3 of the 2001 remasters/card sleeves

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Penis - Vagina user not visiting Queenzone.com

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Posted: 08 Mar 04, 17:49 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

A Kind Of Magic was pretty awesome. The whole thing was a great improvement IMO.

The Miracle is greatly improved and really kicks ass in places. There's things I'd never noticed before. The intro to 'I Want It All' really grabbed me and 'Chinese Torture' sounds amazing. In fact I'm going to upload a file of it if I can figure out where I have space.

Innuendo is where the trouble starts. A couple of tracks seem to sound better.. Headlong & TATDOOL but for some reason the rest sounds the same as '91 or worse. 'I Can't Live With You' is particularly bad. Perhaps the high resolution just exposed how weak it really is.

Also, the Innuendo disc is not amplified very much the way the others are which seems a bit odd to me. Something just doesn't seem right.

I discovered that these do sound a little better going though analog cables btw. With other music, a digital cable usually sounds better but these are just the opposite. I'm sure Adam will explain why or tell me I'm nuts :-P



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Posted: 08 Mar 04, 18:02 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

Here's Chinese Torture. Don't know if Rien already shared this one or not.

See later message for comparison version

Adam Baboolal user not visiting Queenzone.com
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Posted: 09 Mar 04, 08:31 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

Hey dude.

Well, I'm a little confused. I listened to that track in comparison to my HolRecrds version and I prefer the HR version!
Now, I should explain that I've processed my albums to get more out of the sound. Nothing radical. I mentioned this last year to folks about more warmth. Anyway, even when listening to the basic cd for comparison I found myself letdown by the 2001 version.
The mid-range has been greatly reduced, while the obvious highs and lows are punchier. I like those, but the mid-range really disappoints. The lead guitar sounds a lot thinner. I don't know what to say.

I don't know about Innuendo. Maybe if you could post ICLWY to hear?

Peace,
Adam.

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Posted: 09 Mar 04, 08:57 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

Well here's the thing... Analog recordings have their high and low end cut down when recorded. And there's also some midrange build up. Slight. Nature of the system. While digital obviously preserves as much as the recorder used, will allow. Again, nature of that system. However, digital recordings sound too sharp because of this. Quite simply, it wasn't clear, and to some still isn't (!), that you can't represent all the components of the mix at full bandwith.
There has to be a gap for all instruments to shine, but not all can exist in the same space. And a recording with too much highend is described as harsh. Sad really. Just listen to what's capable these days.

And that's part of the reason for what happened with early digital. Not to mention the bad converters used while recording. Sometimes at least. And this is where the analog versus digital thing came from.

Peace,
Adam.

Rien user not visiting Queenzone.com

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Posted: 09 Mar 04, 10:37 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

For a short time you can find I Want It All and I Can't Live With You on my downloadpage.


Feel free to visit my site - http://www.mercuryparadise.com

(Come into my life, it's a MercuryParadise)
Penis - Vagina user not visiting Queenzone.com

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Posted: 09 Mar 04, 10:49 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

Thanks Rien!

I don't know what to say about the differences we're hearing or not hearing. I clearly hear a fullness and clarity to 'The Miracle' tracks that I don't hear on the Hollywood version.. and the Capitol version is absolute junk compared to these of course :)

For my listening copy, I added some extra tracks such as the 12" Scandal from the Hollywood version.. amplified to the level of the original version remaster (but no compression tools or anything) and there's clearly a difference in quality.

But these things can be quite subjective. You can take nearly anything and make adjustments to get it sounding good.. and then compare it to another version and be amazed at the difference.

Here's a fun test for everyone.. open a favorite song in Winamp, adjust your volume, get it sounding right to you. Then turn on the EQ in Winamp and adjust it until you love the sound even more... then turn the EQ off and suddenly you'll realize how weak it sounded before, even though you were enjoying it. hehe

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Posted: 09 Mar 04, 12:43 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

Thanks for those Rien. Again, I'm baffled. I hear what DF is talking about with ICLWY. And I just can't believe they've been remastered this way. It's really bad. Just listen to how thin Freddie's voice is and then compare it to the mix we all have from before. You see, again there's a huge hole in the mid-range. And Freddie's voice, our main focus, suffers greatly because of this. NOT PLEASED...

But IWIA doesn't sound as bad. But still, it's not great. I'm starting to wonder why JSSmith has done this. I've always supported the changes he made for the DVD-A and dvd vids. But these two titles don't seem as good as the earlier ones.

Just some info from me - I'm using 2 sets of studio speakers to listen with. One active and the other passive.

Peace,
Adam.

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Posted: 09 Mar 04, 13:57 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

I know what you're talking about, DF. I used an effect I came up with the EQ on Nero burner for CD Audio which I named "Dark" :P, where I turned up both bass and treble, which actually gives some songs a better sound, clear-wise. If I had some CD-R's, I could make some songs this way and upload as MP3s in the future sometime

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Posted: 09 Mar 04, 14:15 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

I've just listened to the two versions of ICLWY and I must say that the 2004 version sounds much clearer to me. All different instruments and left-right sounds (to put it very simple) can be heard much clearer than on the old cd.



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Penis - Vagina user not visiting Queenzone.com

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Posted: 09 Mar 04, 14:32 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

Here's 29 seconds of 3 editions of 'Chinese Torture' back to back and at 320 kbps. I haven't done any tampering.

The first is the U.S. Capitol CD from 1989, then the U.S. Hollywood remaster from 1991, and finally the 2001 Toshiba/EMI from the 2004 card sleeve.

Obviously the volume level has been increased a bit, but ignoring that, I still think there's a much fuller sound.

**switched to A Kind Of Magic, see below**

I've also just noticed that all 3 versions have a slight 'drop-out' just after the first drum crash.



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Posted: 09 Mar 04, 21:09 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

Hey, Adam or anyone.. listen to that file and tell honestly which of the 3 sounds best, so I can delete the thing :)

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Posted: 10 Mar 04, 04:40 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

Listened to it a few times in Winamp (no eq), small Labtec speakers. To me the Hollywood Remaster sounded the best.




"I think now I can make love to your anus without making God angry"



Registered: Friday, January 18, 2002



Adam Baboolal user not visiting Queenzone.com
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Posted: 10 Mar 04, 07:36 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

Definitely the one in the middle. In comparison with the other two, like I've said before, there's more mid-range. A VERY important part of the sonic picture when it comes to Brian's guitars.

Ah well...

Peace,
Adam.

Penis - Vagina user not visiting Queenzone.com

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Posted: 10 Mar 04, 07:48 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

I think I must have a midrange hearing problem. This is not the first time it's come up. I've had a friend comment on early attempts at 'remixes' "where's the midrange?" and I recall that while growing up, the EQ setting that always seemed right to me was a V shape. LOL

This is why I try not to mess with stuff when I'm doing my little edit jobs. I do sometimes do a little bass boost to try and make something match.

This blows. Stuff I do might sound horrible and I'd never know it :-P

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Posted: 10 Mar 04, 10:08 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

Hi, just got my first two Cardsleeves: Innuendo and Sheer Heart Attack, SHA is amazing, sounds wonderfull, but from Innuendo I'm a little disapointed, too, but it sounds slightly better than the older version anyway so little improvement

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Posted: 10 Mar 04, 10:21 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

HR version

Penis - Vagina user not visiting Queenzone.com

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Posted: 10 Mar 04, 10:45 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

Okay, I listened again.. this time specifically to hear whether something seems to be missing from the 3rd.. and now I hear what you guys are saying. It still seems to have a bit more 'punch' but I agree there's something more to the HW version.

Oh well! And I agree there's something wrong with Innuendo. To me, a couple tracks sound only marginally better but the sound is uneven between tracks.. I mean, some sound okay, some not so great. And ICLWY is definitely worse. It really struck me as sounding bad when it came on.

At least the packaging is cool :-P


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Posted: 10 Mar 04, 11:41 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

Edit: Had to delete this in order to put up another file.

Rien user not visiting Queenzone.com

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Posted: 10 Mar 04, 12:09 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

To me the third sounds the best.


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Adam Baboolal user not visiting Queenzone.com
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Posted: 10 Mar 04, 12:10 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

Not too bad. But JSSmith seems to have thinned this one too. Hmm... I compared DSMN when that was posted and there was a definite improvement there. But I wonder... I mean, the analog recordings benefit from this kind of remastering. But I'm not sure the digitally recorded albums are going to be as "happy" with this processing.

I know that digital type recordings started with The Works onwards, even though it was still dealing with tape. How strange.

Peace,
Adam.