Forums > Queen - Serious Discussion > Ibex recording: with or without Brian & Roger?

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Tim Goossen user not visiting Queenzone.com

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Posted: 24 Jul 04, 17:13 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

Hello folks,

there's a thing that has been on my mind for a very long time:
some people claim that Roger and Brian feature on the Ibex bootleg (namely on Crossroads and Vagabond Outcast). I still doubt it. First of all, I don't believe that R&B joined Ibex on stage and played an Ibex composition without rehearsing. The other thing is that Geoff Higgins (he recorded the concert) says that he ran out of tape before R&B came on stage (http://www.brianmay.com/queen/queenbeforequeen/rcmar96/rcmar96b.html).
Now, I have already mailed the fanclub about this 4 years ago. Greg Brooks replied to me and said that R&B DO feature on the recording as they can hear Freddie thanking Roger for a drink and that they also spoke to people who were there and that they said that the recording features the songs they saw R&B performing.
I thought that the available recording is slightly edited. But to my knowledge, also the unedited recording does not feature R&B... (maybe it does feature the part where you can hear Freddie thanking Roger, I dunno).
So it's a story with contradictions... who can clear this up?

Ciao,
Tim


Music is emotion
John S Stuart user not visiting Queenzone.com
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Posted: 24 Jul 04, 17:25 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

No Brian and Roger do not play on the tape.

They were both in the audience at the gig, and yes you can hear Freddie say "Thank-you Roger", after Roger bought him a drink - so I suppose you could technically say he is on the recording.

Yes, the tape is edited.




"Listen to them. Children of the night. What music they make."
Penetration_Guru user not visiting Queenzone.com
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Posted: 24 Jul 04, 18:45 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

The tape is edited - means there is more material available.
The tape is incomplete - means there isn't.

Any chance of clarification?

Roger's Beard user not visiting Queenzone.com

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Posted: 24 Jul 04, 19:36 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

Apparantly, Roger and Brian DID play with IBEX at that gig.
However, they played on the last couple of songs of the set, by which time the tape recorder had run out of tape long before :(





frejorobri user not visiting Queenzone.com

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Posted: 24 Jul 04, 23:07 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote




"I'm not afraid to speak out and say the things I want and do the things I want,so um,I think in the end that being natural and quite genuine is what wins." Freddie Mercury
The Real Wizard user not visiting Queenzone.com
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Posted: 25 Nov 04, 16:52 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

Penetration_Guru wrote:

The tape is edited - means there is more material available.
The tape is incomplete - means there isn't.

Any chance of clarification?


Well?? Anyone?


"The more generous you are with your music, the more it comes back to you." -- Dan Lampinski



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My Melancholy Blues user not visiting Queenzone.com
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Posted: 25 Nov 04, 18:09 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

I think it is likely that Brian and Roger and Ibex had some chances to jam together. Because, during their stay in London, Ibex frequently rehearsed at the Imperial college and the members of Ibex were regular visitors of the house where Freddie, Brian, Roger and Tim were living together.

I hear at the show at the Sink, Freddie invited Brian and Roger on to the stage to "jam with Ibex/Wreckage".

But according to the Geoff Higgins memory, he couldn't record the numbers which Brian, Roger and Freddie played. And he didn't say what number they( B and R and Ibex) played together.
So, all I can say now is ;
Brian and Roger and Ibex played some numbers or so, but it is somewhat doubtful that what they played toghter were what we hear, that is, "Cross Roads" and "Vagabond Outcast"

I also want to know why these two songs have been considered to be their sessions which might be only one and the last one.



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Estoy bien.
John S Stuart user not visiting Queenzone.com
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Posted: 25 Nov 04, 19:24 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

Q: Ibex recording: with or without Brian & Roger?
A: Without.

I think both PG and Pootle are correct.

Remember this is a pub band. Two sets. Traditionally one set, an interval, then followed with the final closing set. Even to-day, most pub bands follow this routine.

Set one was recorded reel-to-reel. This makes sense because it was a reference reel. (That is - let's hear what we sound like so we can improve the service). The whole set was recorded - but has since been edited to make it a more "enjoyable" listening experience. (So it's not music that has been excised - but long pauses between tracks - and insignificant chatter/banter).

Some of this banter "...thank you Roger..." remains, and helps demonstrate that Mr Higgins recollections are indeed true.

The tape for the second set did NOT accidently run out. This is a horrible dis-service to the work Geoff Higgins did. Actually, the second set was NOT recorded.

With Roger and Brian in the audience, it was pretty certain that they would join in the encore sometime. (Let's face it - you don't travel to a gig with the red special under your arm just for the fun of it!)

The reason this encore set was NOT recorded was this was to be an Ibex reference reel - not Ibex and Smile guests, because it was never imagined that either band would hit any major heights. The sole need for a reference reel is short-term. (How do we improve next week's gig?). With Smile on board as guests - what lessons could be learned for next week's performance?

(I think this idea worked because apparently the bass was never allowed to be so slack again!)

Also, prices were very, very steep at that time. A reel-to-reel blank tape (in real terms if you excuse the pun) was very expensive. Scotch tapes sold around £2.00, which at that time was roughly one third of the average wage. (If the average wage is now £200.00 per week - that means a reel would be roughly valued at £66.00).

Once recorded, (because of price) these tapes were usually re-recorded over. So we are lucky that any of this stuff survives at all. But my point is why waste expensive tape on an indulgence like an Ibex/Smile hybrid, as it would serve no useful purpose.

Ofcourse, hind-sight is a perfect science, and if the TARDIS was free this weekend, then it would be very easy to return back in time to ammend this situation. However, given the circumstances of the situation, I think that what was achieved was truley remarkable.

Finally: Roger and Brian played only on the encore, NOT the first set - therefore, can NOT be on the surviving tape. (That to me seems sound commomn sense). The rumour that they play on certain tracks was actually started by a certain Mr Brooks - but as the old press standard goes, "Never let the truth stand in the way of a good story"

(But that's what happens when you pinch someone else's research!)






"Listen to them. Children of the night. What music they make."
The Real Wizard user not visiting Queenzone.com
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Posted: 26 Nov 04, 00:36 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

Great info there... thanks!


"The more generous you are with your music, the more it comes back to you." -- Dan Lampinski



http://www.queenlive.ca