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Ramses user not visiting Queenzone.com

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Posted: 12 Sep 04, 21:13 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

When a song is attributed to a specific member, what did that member exactly create? Is he responsible for the vocal part along with the guitar, bass and drum parts? It is pretty amazing if they knew enough about all those instruments to write each individual part for a song! If they didn't do it all themselves, how is it determined who "wrote" the song?


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Ramses user not visiting Queenzone.com

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Posted: 12 Sep 04, 22:57 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

Wow...un-freakin-believable. I can't even begin to imagine what writting a song with complete parts and vocals would be like. Ah well...that's talent for you. That's why you won't see me cavorting around stage half-naked any time soon.

LOL...anyway, thank you Jake for the info.


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Maz user not visiting Queenzone.com

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Posted: 12 Sep 04, 23:35 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

Um... Not quite the way it goes.

According to Queen lore, credit went to the one who wrote the lyrics. Contrary to the above post, that person did not write the entire song. In BoRap, for example, Freddie wrote the majority of it, but the guitar solo before the opera section was Brian's. I think, if we look at the songs more in depth, we will see that the other members of the band contributed more to the song writing process, and the person credited as writer steered it the most toward completion. The fights that erupted from this process are also cited as one of the reasons the band took a group songwriting credit on The Miracle and Innuendo.

For more in depth info on the writing process, see Sebastian's website:
http://sebastian.queenconcerts.com/index.htm


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Sebastian user not visiting Queenzone.com
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Posted: 13 Sep 04, 07:20 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

It`s important to note the difference between songwriting and arrangements. For example GnR arranged Knockin` On Heaven`s Door, wrote solos for it and different vocal melodies. But the song is still Bob Dylan`s, because the solos Slash wrote were over the chord progression Bob had made. Because the "new" melodies (actually harmonies in this case) were over the lyrics and chords Bob had put.

Same case - for example The Hitman. Fred wrote it in keyboards, then Brian passed it to guitar, then John made changes in the order. Brian & John are arrangers, Fred is the songwriter. And in most Queen albums they do put that arrangements are by the band.

In rock music the songwriter tends to be the major arranger (as in Bo Rhap), except in the symphonic records (e.g. S&M, The Wall...)


John hated HS. Fred's fave singer was not PR. Roger didn't compose 'Innuendo.' Witness testimonies are often inaccurate. Scotland's not in England. 'Bo Rhap' hasn't got 180 voices.
Brianmay1975 user not visiting Queenzone.com
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Posted: 13 Sep 04, 09:18 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

Sebastian's right, as ever! No reason to doubt his opinions, folks, he knows what he's talking about...

Zeni the Wet Sprocket wrote:

The fights that erupted from this process are also cited as one of the reasons the band took a group songwriting credit on The Miracle and Innuendo.


My opinion is that they took a group songwriting credit on TM and Innuendo because of Freddie's serious illness (which had already become obvious in '89). They were trying to stick together as a band (which they did) and they also "synthesised their differences" ( I'm quoting VH1's Legends Queen), there was no fighting anymore between them...



I LOVE QUEEN!



"My guitar was my weapon and my shield to hide behind" (Brian May)



BackToHuman user not visiting Queenzone.com

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Posted: 13 Sep 04, 10:31 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

I think we've all got our own theories/feelings (most of them pretty similar) as to why the sharing of credits happened on Miracle and Innuendo (but note, those weren't the only times ever that Queen was credited, as opposed to individual members). but what Zeni was saying is that the in-fighting is the reason they gave everyone for their sharing of credits. that's what they told everyone their reason was.

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Posted: 13 Sep 04, 17:55 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

Hola!
"I want it all" is credited on my "The Miracle" album to Queen... but in the spanish WWRY cd is credited to Brian. Ok... maybe he wrote the adaptation to the musical but why Freddie appears like the songwriter of "Crazy little thing called love" in the same cd?? He came from heaven to write spanish adaptations!!!??? ;)


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FriedChicken user not visiting Queenzone.com

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Posted: 13 Sep 04, 18:29 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

And that for example John is credited for you and I doesn't mean he wrote every little guitar note, every drum hit.

It's very likely that the writer of the song gave the freedom of the drumtrack to the drummer. Maybe just giving a few hints "i want it to go like this...and there should be toms on that part, and a crash there" Thats all.

Same goes with Brian, I think that most of the time he wrote the solo. Maybe the writer of the song giving hints to Brian "do this melody" or something like that.


"On the first day Pim & Niek created a heavenly occupation. Pim & Niek blessed it and named it 'Loosch'."



(Genesis 1:1)
Sebastian user not visiting Queenzone.com
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Posted: 13 Sep 04, 19:15 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

I don`t think Brian wrote all the guitar parts always. John`s songs have a very particular way of guitar arrangements, different to Rog`s, Fred`s or Brian`s. Brian himself said Fred went into his solos and said "play this note" or whatever. It depends on the individual song.

For Killer Queen Brian did write the solo (I mean arranged the order of the notes, etc), but the harmonies are by Fred. Proof of that is that they already interact with the piano, which was recorded when Brian didn`t even know the song. Same for Flick Of The Wrist.

Brian usually gave freedom to John and Rog to arrange their own parts, so the songs would have a more live feeling.

Of course the post Magic era is more collaborative in arrangements. The main reason for the credit sharing is that they fought over the royalty thing. If everything was evryone`s, the fights would dissapear, or at least lower.


John hated HS. Fred's fave singer was not PR. Roger didn't compose 'Innuendo.' Witness testimonies are often inaccurate. Scotland's not in England. 'Bo Rhap' hasn't got 180 voices.
Penis - Vagina user not visiting Queenzone.com

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Posted: 13 Sep 04, 21:53 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

My feeling is simply that they would each bring their songs or ideas to the sessions, whether just lyrics or musical ideas, and whatever everyone liked, everyone worked on. Then the one with the original idea got the credit, except in a few cases where they decided to share it for whatever reason.

Until 'The Miracle' sessions when they decided to finally credit everything to everyone. It could be because Freddie was ill, or just because they felt like it, or my personal theory.. that it was Brian's idea since he hadn't had a top 10 hit since 'Flash' :-P (the royalty thing maybe?)

But I get the feeling they always pretty much contributed to each other's songs.. they just didn't always credit them that way.

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Posted: 14 Sep 04, 01:14 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

Llisos wrote:


"I want it all" is credited on my "The Miracle" album to Queen... but in the spanish WWRY cd is credited to Brian. )


We know that it is a Brian song; there's little doubt of that. And this would mark the second time that IWIA was credited to Brian instead of Queen (46664 being the other instance). When 46664 came out and we saw the revised credit, there was a bit of debate as to why it would change all of a sudden.


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Maz user not visiting Queenzone.com

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Posted: 14 Sep 04, 01:14 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

whirled peas wrote:


But I get the feeling they always pretty much contributed to each other's songs.. they just didn't always credit them that way.


Yep, me too.


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Penis - Vagina user not visiting Queenzone.com

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Posted: 14 Sep 04, 01:45 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

GVH2 was the first to credit Brian with IWIA I believe :) So that makes 3.