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John S Stuart user not visiting Queenzone.com
John S Stuart
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Posted: 01 Oct 04, 14:09 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

Is there a connection between the Queen and Led Zepp versions of "Hangman"?
As far as I know - the Queen vesion was not an original - but a cover version, so if not Leddie - who?

(Unless you have heard the Queen version - there's no point in replying!)




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John S Stuart user not visiting Queenzone.com
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Posted: 01 Oct 04, 14:16 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

This is weird - the topic should be "Hangman" - see above, but it registers as "No Subject".

I have no idea about the above reply though! It looks like an answer to another thread!

Even weirder - it registers "Hangman" now! - WEIRD!


"Listen to them. Children of the night. What music they make."
[ Wybren™ ] user not visiting Queenzone.com

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Posted: 01 Oct 04, 14:25 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

John S Stuart wrote:

Is there a connection between the Queen and Led Zepp versions of "Hangman"?
As far as I know - the Queen vesion was not an original - but a cover version, so if not Leddie - who?

(Unless you have heard the Queen version - there's no point in replying!)



I read somewhere that Queen's Hangman was a Wreckage song by Freddie. I've never heard Led Zep's Hangman btw...


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Lester Burnham user not visiting Queenzone.com

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Posted: 01 Oct 04, 14:38 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

It's actually 'Gallows Pole' from Led Zeppelin III, and there is no connection, from what I understand. Queen's chorus of 'Hangman' goes:

"Hangman, hangman, waiting for me
Hang that rope from the highest tree
I don't want to beg for mercy
Hangman, hangman, hangman, I tell you"

But Led Zeppelin's is:

"Hangman, hangman, hold it a little while,
Think I see my friends coming, riding a-many mile."

Perhaps Freddie and Brian, who reportedly wrote the song, were trying to model it after Led Zep's arrangement of Leadbelly's original?

John S Stuart user not visiting Queenzone.com
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Posted: 01 Oct 04, 14:51 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

[ Wybren™ ]: "I read somewhere that Queen's Hangman was a Wreckage song by Freddie".

Yes, that is indeed true, but it was a cover version and not an original Mercury composition. Remember Brain May was not in "Wreckage", both he and Roger were really involved with Smile at the time, so it's difficult to see how (but not impossible) it could be a Mercury/May collaboration.

Lester: You are also correct it is "Gallows Pole", but in my mind I was thinking about the line:

"Hangman, hangman, hold it a little while,
Think I see my friends coming, riding a-many mile."

You are also correct regarding the Queen lyric:

"Hangman, hangman, waiting for me
Hang that rope from the highest tree
I don't want to beg for mercy
Hangman, hangman, hangman, I tell you"

So if not connected - they may stem from the same root. I really like your idea though perhaps they
"were trying to model it after... Leadbelly's original?". Unfortunately, I have never heard the Leadbelly version. Do you think this could be the root for both?





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Lester Burnham user not visiting Queenzone.com

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Posted: 01 Oct 04, 15:22 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

John S Stuart wrote:

Yes, that is indeed true, but it was a cover version and not an original Mercury composition. Remember Brian May was not in "Wreckage", both he and Roger were really involved with Smile at the time, so it's difficult to see how (but not impossible) it could be a Mercury/May collaboration.


Remember also that 'Stone Cold Crazy' was originally a Wreckage song, but was eventually credited to May/Mercury/Taylor/Deacon. It's possible, then, that it was originally a Mercury restructuring that Brian later contributed to. It's all speculation, but not out of the question.

I really like your idea though perhaps they "were trying to model it after... Leadbelly's original?". Unfortunately, I have never heard the Leadbelly version. Do you think this could be the root for both?


I, too, have never heard the Leadbelly version either, but it's not entirely out of the question. Keep in mind that Brian restructured 'See What A Fool I've Been' based on a Brownie McGhee and Sonny Terry song, yet he still received the actual credit. This could very likely be the case for 'Hangman', as well.

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Posted: 01 Oct 04, 22:25 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

Peter Hince (aka Ratty) confirmed that Freddie wrote Hangman


John hated HS. Fred's fave singer was not PR. Roger didn't compose 'Innuendo.' Witness testimonies are often inaccurate. Scotland's not in England. 'Bo Rhap' hasn't got 180 voices.
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Posted: 01 Oct 04, 22:40 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

It doesn sound very Freddie... Atleast that's what I've always thought (since the first time I heard it anyhow).


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Posted: 01 Oct 04, 22:40 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

heh, I love it. So full of information you are :)


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Lester Burnham user not visiting Queenzone.com

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Posted: 02 Oct 04, 01:25 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

I'm good for something around here!

Sebastian user not visiting Queenzone.com
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Posted: 02 Oct 04, 04:37 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

Actually it is very Freddie-esque in the context of the era. Keep in mind that he wrote it in late 60s or early 70s. Before he composed piano ballads and musichall influenced tracks, he was basically a hard rock / heavy metal composer (Ogre Battle, Liar...)


John hated HS. Fred's fave singer was not PR. Roger didn't compose 'Innuendo.' Witness testimonies are often inaccurate. Scotland's not in England. 'Bo Rhap' hasn't got 180 voices.
Roger_in_Tigerskin_Trousers user not visiting Queenzone.com

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Posted: 02 Oct 04, 06:41 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

sounds like Fred borrowed the theme. He did like LED ZEP after all.


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Who wants body language instead of liar

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Jjeroen user not visiting Queenzone.com

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Posted: 02 Oct 04, 06:46 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

First, to follow Sebastian: according to Brian himself he wrote the music and Freddie wrote the words (handwritten letter for proof!)

Second: I have the Leadbelly song (which is indeed called 'Gallows Pole'. It very obviously was an influence to the Zepp song with the same name. But I hear no resembalce whatsoever with Queen's Hangman...

Cheers

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Posted: 02 Oct 04, 07:36 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

With all respect to Ratty, he came to Queen years after Hangman was written so... he only knows what he maybe was told about it.

Sebastian user not visiting Queenzone.com
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Posted: 02 Oct 04, 07:56 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

Yes my only quote source is Ratty so I don`t have any concrete evidence (like a quote from someone else matching it or whatever)

A musical analysis results imo in a much more concrete evidence anyway because the answers are right there in the song (structure, harmony, etc). But in the case of Hangman, the song`s so simple that any of them (including John, from the hypothetical point of view of course) could have written it.

Do you think it`d be possible to scan the letter?

Thanks


John hated HS. Fred's fave singer was not PR. Roger didn't compose 'Innuendo.' Witness testimonies are often inaccurate. Scotland's not in England. 'Bo Rhap' hasn't got 180 voices.
[ Wybren™ ] user not visiting Queenzone.com

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Posted: 02 Oct 04, 08:02 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

Maybe someone could ask Brian about Hangman on Brianmay.com? But I don't think Brian knows exactly who wrote it.


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Posted: 02 Oct 04, 08:57 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

Yeah, with all those people inhere that just post crap, I understand lots of people don't believe anything anymore when you say something ;-)

A scan of (part of) the letter will be in Sebastians mailbox in a couple of minutes!

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Posted: 02 Oct 04, 09:17 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

Should've arrived at Seb's. I gotta go now, please let me know (inhere or in mail) if it came through alright.

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Posted: 02 Oct 04, 09:25 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

...and now sent to Martin as well! Talk to you guys after the weekend ;-)


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Posted: 02 Oct 04, 10:55 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

HeMaToSe_SuInA<font size=1><br>[aka HeM] wrote:

Hangman was never recorded by Queen, just played live, right? So, does anybody know some site where it can be downloaded, but not in FLAC format and shared only by BitTorrent, but mp3 or WMA and hosted in some server?

Thanks in advance.


Try this one HEMA

http://www.queen.buum.pl/muzyka/mp3.htm