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Johnny Knoxville user not visiting Queenzone.com

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Posted: 21 Jun 05, 14:15 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

Hello,
What is so unique about Brian's Brighton Rock solo, he did it on Starlicks, but why do Guitar magazines keep going on about it? its just like all his other solos.


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Posted: 21 Jun 05, 14:17 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

probably because I think it's the first of his songs to feature an extended guitar solo...

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Posted: 21 Jun 05, 15:41 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

He used 2 Echoplex tape delay units to create a form of harmony and counterpoint he could play live.
Think of a song like Row your Boat or Frere Jacques which are known as rounds
These are the simplest and most familiar types of counterpoint. In a round, everyone sings the same melody, but they start singing it at different times.

It is possible to recreate this effect by using a digital delay set at 900 milliseconds with 2 repeats.
It was groundbreaking at the time and Brian May still does it better than anyone else.

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Posted: 21 Jun 05, 17:35 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

bitesthedust wrote:

probably because I think it's the first of his songs to feature an extended guitar solo...

but it wasn't

the brighton rock solo evolved from the son and daughter solo
which in turn was a direct offspring of the solo in the SMILE track 'BLAG'
you only have to hear 'blag' to realise that Brian hadn't got a new solo in him - almost 5 years after he first did it....and the fact that this solo remained as predictably long and tedious (in concert) 27 years after he first put it onto vinyl is a pretty poor show


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Posted: 21 Jun 05, 20:40 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

Yeah, I've got to agree there, much as I'm a Queen bore(to quote my lovely stepdaughter!)I cannot listen to Brians Brighton Rock solo live for more than 2 minutes before I have an unrational desire to cut my ears off.

It serves it's purpose though, cause last month at Newcastle, as soon as Brian kicked into his solo, that was me and my Partners cue to go into the foyer for a toilet break and a couple of large glasses of wine so it aint all bad!

The News Of The World Tour version of Brighton Rock was fine but then the sneaky bastard managed to bray his solo in at the end of the Prophet Song, I guess there's just no escaping it eh?

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Posted: 21 Jun 05, 21:31 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

teleman wrote:

He used 2 Echoplex tape delay units to create a form of harmony and counterpoint he could play live.
Think of a song like Row your Boat or Frere Jacques which are known as rounds
These are the simplest and most familiar types of counterpoint. In a round, everyone sings the same melody, but they start singing it at different times.

It is possible to recreate this effect by using a digital delay set at 900 milliseconds with 2 repeats.
It was groundbreaking at the time and Brian May still does it better than anyone else.


I like this post and agree with it.


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Posted: 22 Jun 05, 04:58 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

teleman wrote:

He used 2 Echoplex tape delay units to create a form of harmony and counterpoint he could play live.
Think of a song like Row your Boat or Frere Jacques which are known as rounds
These are the simplest and most familiar types of counterpoint. In a round, everyone sings the same melody, but they start singing it at different times.

It is possible to recreate this effect by using a digital delay set at 900 milliseconds with 2 repeats.
It was groundbreaking at the time and Brian May still does it better than anyone else.


Yes.......I can actually get the same effect rather easily with my Korg multi effect pedal thing.......of course, I cant play like Brian, though!

Incidentally, I have heard a clip of Yngwie Malmsteen doing something very similar live........I wonder if he was inspired by Mr. May? I do remember him covering Keep Yourself Alive, anyway......



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Posted: 22 Jun 05, 07:19 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

True, it is essentially the same solo over and over, with the change here and there.

But, to be honest, I personally do not think there is another guitarist out there (or possibly has been...) who could pull off what Brian does without completely messing it up. All those echos, and the repeats and the harmonies, any normal man would screw it up completely.

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Posted: 22 Jun 05, 11:51 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

as a guitar freak and a brian may fan i love that brighton rock solo. in fact ive started to do the same style of brighton rock.

i made up this solo and i put it through the tape echo and it sounds fcukin class. my friends and music teacher loves it


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Posted: 22 Jun 05, 13:53 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

I can play it, I can mimick it - but he MADE it for crying out loud, the man's a hero. Why are people so rough on him???

I'd rather listen to his guitar solo than read this thread put it that way - <exits>


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Posted: 23 Jun 05, 06:45 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

Johnny Knoxville wrote:

Hello,
What is so unique about Brian's Brighton Rock solo, he did it on Starlicks, but why do Guitar magazines keep going on about it? its just like all his other solos.


Probably coz it's good...


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Posted: 23 Jun 05, 13:26 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

teleman wrote:

It is possible to recreate this effect by using a digital delay set at 900 milliseconds with 2 repeats.
It was groundbreaking at the time and Brian May still does it better than anyone else.


I'd say it's about 700ms, not 900. Who else uses that much delay? I don't think I've ever heard anyone else do it...

Steve Howe from Yes was using delay in 1972, but it was a mono delay (the ending of Long Distance Runaround)... really pretty. It's all a matter of taste. Surely some people would prefer Howe's quick delay to Brian's extended delay.

Perhaps John S Stuart could answer this question... was Brian using the digital delay in his solos back in 70/71? I think he has some live recordings of Queen from that era, so perhaps this could shed some light on who really was the first to do it. I can't think of anyone else besides Howe.



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Posted: 23 Jun 05, 14:36 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

850ms to be exact.


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Posted: 23 Jun 05, 15:31 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

I thought it was 800. You can see it on the machines in the Master Sessions video.

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Posted: 23 Jun 05, 16:00 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

was Brian using the digital delay in his solos back in 70/71?

There was no digital delay in 70/71
He was using tape delays.

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Posted: 24 Jun 05, 04:43 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

ok ok id love to get this accurate for my own settings on my Line 6 POD (as so far ive just been doing it by ear) exactly what is the delay time used by Brian? 800, 850 or 900 milliseconds?
:-S

Kev x


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Posted: 27 Jun 05, 04:57 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

Guys?? :-S


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Posted: 27 Jun 05, 05:18 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

I remember reading somewhere, I dont remember where, that it was 800ms.......but I'd bet Brian varied it himself....


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Posted: 27 Jun 05, 05:20 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

I do have that programmed into my Korg AX100G (the 800ms, 2 repeat echo thing)......I even have a setting I labeled "KYA" (a vague approximation of the tone in Keep Yourself Alive's intro) :)


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Posted: 27 Jun 05, 05:34 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

Kev, you're talking about a variance of a 10th of a second. Any of the lengths you talk about will sound fine.

If you're that keen to have it EXACTLY right, just use one of the lengths and play along with Brian, and see if the repeat comes in too soon or too late, and either lengthen or shorten the delay accordingly.


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