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thomasquinn 32989 user not visiting Queenzone.com
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Posted: 23 Sep 06, 10:58 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

It was 80 years ago today, that jazz legend John Coltrane, father of the free-jazz and forerunner in the post-bop, was born. Although he tragically died of a liver-ailment in '67, his music still lives on.

Naima (1965) :
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q6WwuxqXPOg

Impressions (1961, feat. Eric Dolphy) :
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kUzFbT5JT1M

My Favorite Things (1961, feat. Eric Dolphy) :
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fKOr7IkGlIs

Alabama (1963) :
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8j_TDoOPnIA

I Want To Talk About You (1962, live in Stockholm) :
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NuGkDmMVoi4


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Posted: 23 Sep 06, 11:16 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

Well like I said during the Freddie happy birthday threads and will do for the upcoming posts that celebrate birthdays of dead people:

"He's dead, so not really having a birthday at the moment."

There's no point in celebrating a dead man or woman's birthday. period.


Micrówave wrote: I would prefer they release a concert of all four sitting at a table just talking about Queen without exerting any kind of energy. Well, maybe Fred can smoke
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Posted: 23 Sep 06, 11:21 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

There is a major point in celebrating a dead person's music, and a birthday is a good point to focus some attention to that. Christians celebrate the birthday of a guy who supposedly lived and died 2000 years ago, who left no works behind, and whom we know from what is at the best third-hand accounts.


Not Plutus but Apollo rules Parnassus

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Posted: 23 Sep 06, 11:30 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

<b><font color = "crimson"> ThomasQuinn wrote:

There is a major point in celebrating a dead person's music, and a birthday is a good point to focus some attention to that. Christians celebrate the birthday of a guy who supposedly lived and died 2000 years ago, who left no works behind, and whom we know from what is at the best third-hand accounts.

Amen. And happy birthday, John Coltrane! :D


-Things Have Changed For Me-
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Posted: 23 Sep 06, 12:13 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

Hey Caspar... besides John Coltrane what other Jazz legends do you recommend listening to.

I'm sort of new to the Jazz genre, so besides Louis Armstrong, Glenn Miller, and Ella Fitgerald I don't know that much.


[QUOTE][QUOTENAME]Brandon wrote: [/QUOTENAME]... and now the "best you can offer is Mr. Jingles? HA! He's... just pathetic.[/QUOTE]
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Posted: 23 Sep 06, 14:37 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

Mr.Jingles wrote:

Hey Caspar... besides John Coltrane what other Jazz legends do you recommend listening to.

I'm sort of new to the Jazz genre, so besides Louis Armstrong, Glenn Miller, and Ella Fitgerald I don't know that much.


Classic Jazz:

Billie Hoilday (lady day), Miles Davis, Duke Ellington, Etta James (but she could be considered blues also, one my favorite!) Quincy Jones, Cab Calloway, Lena Horne...etc :)


Loving the pass, cherishing the present, and looking forward to the future

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Posted: 23 Sep 06, 14:46 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

You name mainly vocal jazz there, from which Dinah Washington, Bessie Smith and Billie Holiday are missing, IMHO. If you like the instrumental work as well, it all depends on taste:

If you're all for the 'laid-back' style, I recommend Chet Baker, Stan Getz, Lester Young, Lee Konitz and, a little older, the big-bands of Lionel Hampton and Count Basie. In addition, you could try Donald Byrd and Horace Silver.

For a more energetic type of jazz, you would be more interested in Art Blakey (& The Jazz Messengers), Charlie Parker, Dizzy Gillespie, Miles Davis' 1950s work, Dexter Gordon (very good idea), Sonny Rollins, Max Roach, Sonny Stitt, Bud Powell. John Coltrane's work up to "A Love Supreme" would go here as well.

Then, if you are ready for a bit of a challenge, and would like to try some of the more experimental jazz (mostly energetic, but sometimes really laid-back as well), try Charles Mingus, Ornette Coleman, John Coltrane, Eric Dolphy, Jaki Byard (a little obscure, though).

For the really experimental stuff (I wouldn't START here, but gently work towards it), you could try John Coltrane's work from "Meditations" onwards, Don Cherry, Archie Shepp, Bill Dixon, Cecil Taylor, Sun Ra, Albert Ayler, Don Pullen

It's all a matter of taste. Most swing is easily accessible, by the way, if you are looking for something which is decent music, but doesn't require too much work. Duke Ellington is a fine example (one of the most technically competent arrangers and composers of his day).


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Posted: 23 Sep 06, 15:31 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

A true musical legend, created music to inspire generations to come. Cheers


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Posted: 23 Sep 06, 21:59 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

Eighty. Wow. How quickly time flies!


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Posted: 24 Sep 06, 01:45 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

The master, a galactic musician, i'm happy cause he's now jammin with Miles and Hendrix, maybe Monk

God bless Coltrane


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Posted: 24 Sep 06, 08:19 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

<b><font color = "crimson"> ThomasQuinn wrote:

There is a major point in celebrating a dead person's music, and a birthday is a good point to focus some attention to that. Christians celebrate the birthday of a guy who supposedly lived and died 2000 years ago, who left no works behind, and whom we know from what is at the best third-hand accounts.


I won't get into a religious argument here, but if a message of "love, compassion, and tolerance" can't be considered a important piece of work, then you're blind.

Despite of what any one thinks about whether if Jesus was really the son of God or not, it doesn't really matter. What matters is that his work inspired people like Mother Theresa, Martin Luther King, and even Gandhi who was not a christian.

At least for what we know Jesus left on this world a lot more than just defending one sided views on a message board.


[QUOTE][QUOTENAME]Brandon wrote: [/QUOTENAME]... and now the "best you can offer is Mr. Jingles? HA! He's... just pathetic.[/QUOTE]
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Posted: 24 Sep 06, 08:39 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

Mr.Jingles wrote:

<b><font color = "crimson"> ThomasQuinn wrote:

There is a major point in celebrating a dead person's music, and a birthday is a good point to focus some attention to that. Christians celebrate the birthday of a guy who supposedly lived and died 2000 years ago, who left no works behind, and whom we know from what is at the best third-hand accounts.


I won't get into a religious argument here, but if a message of "love, compassion, and tolerance" can't be considered a important piece of work, then you're blind.

Despite of what any one thinks about whether if Jesus was really the son of God or not, it doesn't really matter. What matters is that his work inspired people like Mother Theresa, Martin Luther King, and even Gandhi who was not a christian.

At least for what we know Jesus left on this world a lot more than just defending one sided views on a message board.


This was not a religious remark, it was putting the comment of the person who criticized me for bringing up Coltrane's birthday in perspective. What I make clear is that a legacy is enough justification for the celebration of a birthday.


Not Plutus but Apollo rules Parnassus

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Posted: 24 Sep 06, 10:58 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

You realize of course, that John Coltrane has been officially recognized as a saint in the African Orthodox Church?


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Posted: 24 Sep 06, 15:25 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

<font color=purple>Miss James wrote:

I cannot believe John Coltrane is even being compared to Jesus. And this goes for any musician.


Yeah, neither can I. John Coltrane and other musicians actually have reliable biographies which their legacies are derived from.


"The more generous you are with your music, the more it comes back to you." -- Dan Lampinski



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Posted: 25 Sep 06, 01:12 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

<b><font color = "crimson"> ThomasQuinn wrote:

You name mainly vocal jazz there, from which Dinah Washington, Bessie Smith and Billie Holiday are missing, IMHO. If you like the instrumental work as well, it all depends on taste:

If you're all for the 'laid-back' style, I recommend Chet Baker, Stan Getz, Lester Young, Lee Konitz and, a little older, the big-bands of Lionel Hampton and Count Basie. In addition, you could try Donald Byrd and Horace Silver.

For a more energetic type of jazz, you would be more interested in Art Blakey (& The Jazz Messengers), Charlie Parker, Dizzy Gillespie, Miles Davis' 1950s work, Dexter Gordon (very good idea), Sonny Rollins, Max Roach, Sonny Stitt, Bud Powell. John Coltrane's work up to "A Love Supreme" would go here as well.

Then, if you are ready for a bit of a challenge, and would like to try some of the more experimental jazz (mostly energetic, but sometimes really laid-back as well), try Charles Mingus, Ornette Coleman, John Coltrane, Eric Dolphy, Jaki Byard (a little obscure, though).

For the really experimental stuff (I wouldn't START here, but gently work towards it), you could try John Coltrane's work from "Meditations" onwards, Don Cherry, Archie Shepp, Bill Dixon, Cecil Taylor, Sun Ra, Albert Ayler, Don Pullen

It's all a matter of taste. Most swing is easily accessible, by the way, if you are looking for something which is decent music, but doesn't require too much work. Duke Ellington is a fine example (one of the most technically competent arrangers and composers of his day).


Wow, you know a lot about jazz Thomas!

Actually Bessie Smith was a blues singer, but classic blues (in the 1920's) sounded so close to jazz (at least to me) that it was hard to tell the difference...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bessie_Smith

Dinah Washington was actually both blues and jazz...etc

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dinah_Washington


Do you (or anybody on here like Peggy Lee, or Sarah Vaughan?)






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Posted: 25 Sep 06, 05:29 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

eh stupido wrote:

Well like I said during the Freddie happy birthday threads and will do for the upcoming posts that celebrate birthdays of dead people:

"He's dead, so not really having a birthday at the moment."

There's no point in celebrating a dead man or woman's birthday. period.


There's no point in celebrating a *living* person's birthday, by your own standards. Our day of birth is something over 90% of us probably don't even remember *at all*.

Let me explain the reasoning (however flawed) behind birthday celebrations:

The thing is - each year, as the 'anniversary' so-called passes by, one might feel inclined to reminisce about what good times they've had with a person. They organise a social gathering, in some cases, with appropriate food and drink on standby in case anyone gets bored of the jazz on the stereo (as if!).

A time of reflection, you might call it - they look back on their lives, their achievements, and the people they associate with use it as a chance to socialise.

Now in the case of someone who is dead, I still think it's appropriate to at least ACKNOWLEDGE the date of their birth (or death) as it gives you a chance to indulge in the good things they did, remember the fun times you had with them (or in the case of Jesus or Coltrane - you get to remember the fun times you had because of their influence on your life). The reasoning is still there... just because the guest of honour croaked sometime previously makes no-never-mind to me.

Keep in mind, more often than not a birthday party is an indulgence of the people who *know* the person who's getting older; more a sign of their appreciation of said person. Since so many of Coltrane's fans are still alive; I think his birthday would be *MORE* than an appropriate time to celebrate his works!

But that's just me, obviously.


"Your not funny, your not a good musician, theres a difference between being funny and being an idiot, you obviously being the latter" - Dave R Fuller
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Posted: 29 Sep 06, 10:19 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

<font color=Aqua>Retro<font color=1>Love wrote:

<b><font color = "crimson"> ThomasQuinn wrote:

You name mainly vocal jazz there, from which Dinah Washington, Bessie Smith and Billie Holiday are missing, IMHO. If you like the instrumental work as well, it all depends on taste:

If you're all for the 'laid-back' style, I recommend Chet Baker, Stan Getz, Lester Young, Lee Konitz and, a little older, the big-bands of Lionel Hampton and Count Basie. In addition, you could try Donald Byrd and Horace Silver.

For a more energetic type of jazz, you would be more interested in Art Blakey (& The Jazz Messengers), Charlie Parker, Dizzy Gillespie, Miles Davis' 1950s work, Dexter Gordon (very good idea), Sonny Rollins, Max Roach, Sonny Stitt, Bud Powell. John Coltrane's work up to "A Love Supreme" would go here as well.

Then, if you are ready for a bit of a challenge, and would like to try some of the more experimental jazz (mostly energetic, but sometimes really laid-back as well), try Charles Mingus, Ornette Coleman, John Coltrane, Eric Dolphy, Jaki Byard (a little obscure, though).

For the really experimental stuff (I wouldn't START here, but gently work towards it), you could try John Coltrane's work from "Meditations" onwards, Don Cherry, Archie Shepp, Bill Dixon, Cecil Taylor, Sun Ra, Albert Ayler, Don Pullen

It's all a matter of taste. Most swing is easily accessible, by the way, if you are looking for something which is decent music, but doesn't require too much work. Duke Ellington is a fine example (one of the most technically competent arrangers and composers of his day).


Wow, you know a lot about jazz Thomas!

Actually Bessie Smith was a blues singer, but classic blues (in the 1920's) sounded so close to jazz (at least to me) that it was hard to tell the difference...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bessie_Smith

Dinah Washington was actually both blues and jazz...etc

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dinah_Washington


Do you (or anybody on here like Peggy Lee, or Sarah Vaughan?)





You are right in that Bessie Smith was technically a blues-singer, but the line is often very fine. Blues is a kind of borderline-style; it is so wide it overlaps with nearly every kind of music. For instance, one could argue Johnny Winter, traditionally labeled electronic blues, as being either blues or hardrock. The same goes for jazz/blues. Most jazz-songs are based on either blues-progressions, or the chords of a popular non-jazz song. This makes that the treatment of a blues can make it into a jazz song, which was the case in for instance Cannonball Adderley's music, as well as Horace Silver, who also included gospel, and also Bessie Smith.

Peggy Lee was a very good singer, but her style was just not my cup of tea. Sarah Vaughan had a beatiful voice, and some great work, but also made some dramatically poor stuff, IMHO.


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Posted: 01 Oct 06, 12:39 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

Dinah Washington's "Smoke Gets In Your Eyes" = pure gold. I also like her duets with Brook Benton. Now those are a couple of smooth voices!


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Posted: 01 Oct 06, 19:29 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

Zebonka12 wrote:

eh stupido wrote:

Well like I said during the Freddie happy birthday threads and will do for the upcoming posts that celebrate birthdays of dead people:

"He's dead, so not really having a birthday at the moment."

There's no point in celebrating a dead man or woman's birthday. period.


There's no point in celebrating a *living* person's birthday, by your own standards. Our day of birth is something over 90% of us probably don't even remember *at all*.

Let me explain the reasoning (however flawed) behind birthday celebrations:

The thing is - each year, as the 'anniversary' so-called passes by, one might feel inclined to reminisce about what good times they've had with a person. They organise a social gathering, in some cases, with appropriate food and drink on standby in case anyone gets bored of the jazz on the stereo (as if!).

A time of reflection, you might call it - they look back on their lives, their achievements, and the people they associate with use it as a chance to socialise.

Now in the case of someone who is dead, I still think it's appropriate to at least ACKNOWLEDGE the date of their birth (or death) as it gives you a chance to indulge in the good things they did, remember the fun times you had with them (or in the case of Jesus or Coltrane - you get to remember the fun times you had because of their influence on your life). The reasoning is still there... just because the guest of honour croaked sometime previously makes no-never-mind to me.

Keep in mind, more often than not a birthday party is an indulgence of the people who *know* the person who's getting older; more a sign of their appreciation of said person. Since so many of Coltrane's fans are still alive; I think his birthday would be *MORE* than an appropriate time to celebrate his works!

But that's just me, obviously.


Totally agree. My parents passed away..Mom in 1999, and Dad in 2000. And on their birthdays I make my way to the cemetary and lay flowers and wish them a happy birthday. I would never think of not doing so. They are still a part of my life (and always will be), and I think about them everyday.


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