Forums > Queen - General Discussion > Comparing KISS and Queen concerts...

forum rss feed
Author

Deacon Fan user not visiting Queenzone.com
on vacation
Deacon Fan
Royalty: 1757 posts
add to buddy list send PM

Posted: 17 Dec 06, 13:03 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

I don't have much to share other than to say I noticed the new KISS DVD set apparently includes 4 complete concerts, including Houston 1977 at the Summit.. same venue Queen played that year.

Assuming it's a decent release, I find it very sad that Queen Productions aren't doing similar releases.. imagine a 4 concert set with say, Rainbow, Earl's Hyde, Court Park and Houston. Maybe even Hammy. One show from each year 1974-1977 as the first DVD set.

masterstroke_84 user not visiting Queenzone.com

Bohemian: 542 posts
add to buddy list send PM

Posted: 17 Dec 06, 13:24 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

KISS concerts are FULL... FULL of overdubs... and practically the whole KISS live albums are overdubs... the only way that you can compare is listening to some bootleg...

Queen were better live... because they not only put a hell of a show, but also have great musical perfomances... I think KISS only have a great visual show but not a great music show... Queen were awesome in both aspects.

Cheers!

P.




Queen rocks!
brENsKi user not visiting Queenzone.com
How shall we f**k off, Oh Lord
brENsKi
Deity: 8088 posts
add to buddy list send PM

Posted: 17 Dec 06, 14:05 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

masterstroke_84 wrote:

KISS concerts are FULL... FULL of overdubs... and practically the whole KISS live albums are overdubs... the only way that you can compare is listening to some bootleg...

Queen were better live... because they not only put a hell of a show, but also have great musical perfomances... I think KISS only have a great visual show but not a great music show... Queen were awesome in both aspects.

Cheers!

P.



you clearly have not listened to Live Killers


go deo na h√Čireann
masterstroke_84 user not visiting Queenzone.com

Bohemian: 542 posts
add to buddy list send PM

Posted: 17 Dec 06, 14:15 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

Yes I Do... but comparing to KISS records... LK is less full of overdubs... I have 4 or 5 boots of ´79 and the overdubs of LK are very tinny... in the case of Alive 3 and 4... those records were mostky recorded in the studio more than in a gig :S...

You didn´t get the point...

P.



Queen rocks!
masterstroke_84 user not visiting Queenzone.com

Bohemian: 542 posts
add to buddy list send PM

Posted: 17 Dec 06, 14:15 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

*mostly


Queen rocks!
brENsKi user not visiting Queenzone.com
How shall we f**k off, Oh Lord
brENsKi
Deity: 8088 posts
add to buddy list send PM

Posted: 17 Dec 06, 15:21 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

masterstroke_84 wrote:

Yes I Do... but comparing to KISS records... LK is less full of overdubs... I have 4 or 5 boots of ´79 and the overdubs of LK are very tinny... in the case of Alive 3 and 4... those records were mostky recorded in the studio more than in a gig :S...

You didn´t get the point...

P.


you need to make fairer comparisons...LK was 79...and it was full of overdubds...queen even admit as much...and "rcorded from over 50 shows" when there were only 23 tracks on the album kinda implies stacks of overdubs

as for kss...the fairer comparison is a live album from the same time period...ie - Alive II
...whicxh had the same number fo overdubs as LK...btu sounded better...as a "live album" it sounded better - had better atmos and didn't sound empty


go deo na h√Čireann
Wiley user not visiting Queenzone.com

Royalty: 1704 posts
add to buddy list send PM

Posted: 17 Dec 06, 15:48 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

I saw Kiss live on 2004 and loved their show. The music's quality is not BoRhap or MOTBQ quality because most songs are simple rockers without many pretensions. The visuals, pyrotechnics and stunts were GREAT!

Come on, 3 out of 4 band members "flew" during the show. Gene Simmons makes a 20 meters jump after his bass solo using a crane and a wire (which you don't notice when he gets it) and then performs Detroit Rock City from a tiny stage up near the roof. Paul Stanley hops into a metal step connected to a horizontal wire which takes him flying over the audience and into a small sub stage between the audience to perform I was made for loving you. The drummer (I believe it was Eric Singer) rises with his drumset over a platform with fire below it resembling a rocket lifting off.

I saw Queen and Paul Rodgers in 2005 and 2006 and I was still amazed by their show. The LIGHTS were MUCH BETTER than Kiss'. There was ZERO pyrotechnics or stunts but that was never Queen's style.

Queen's catalog is full of GREAT songs, most of them very melodic, some of them more complex than the average Kiss song (from what I've heard) and better. Queen are better musician's, although they had many mistakes during their 2005 tour. 2006 was another story. San Diego 2006 was miles better than any other show I've ever been to.

On the "talent" level, Rodgers' voice is much better than Simmons' or Stanley's (let's not EVEN compare them with Freddie, all right?). Brian's guitar playing is WAAAAY better than Stanley or Thayer (whatever their new guitarist's name is).

Queen's show depends almost entirely on the performer's quality (which is huge). I think Kiss can have a shitty performance and you'd still enjoy their concert because of the stunts and pyrotechnics. Still, I prefer Queen any day of the week, hehe :).

Sorry for the long post.
See ya,

Wiley



jpf user not visiting Queenzone.com

Bohemian: 710 posts
add to buddy list send PM

Posted: 17 Dec 06, 17:02 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

masterstroke_84 wrote:

KISS concerts are FULL... FULL of overdubs...


How the hell do you overdub a live concert?
You're really talking out of your ass.

As far as the original question goes ...

There's KISS in concert, then there's everyone else. Queen, visually, was good. KISS wrote the book on the concert experience.

masterstroke_84 wrote:

and practically the whole KISS live albums are overdubs... the only way that you can compare is listening to some bootleg...


Queen "Live Killers" was all cut and paste. There are lines from one city intermixed with lines from other cities in a single track. If you listen carefully you can hear where the edits are.

KISS released Instant Live recordings from almost all of the shows on their "Rock The Nation" tour in 2004. I received my copy 20 minutes after the concert finished. No overdubs, just a great concert souvenir.

masterstroke_84 wrote:

Queen were better live... because they not only put a hell of a show, but also have great musical perfomances... I think KISS only have a great visual show but not a great music show... Queen were awesome in both aspects.


Sounds like you've never attended a KISS concert.

Listen to Queen's Hyde Park show. Freddie was terrible.


"Every night's a party at Melina's mansion!"
jpf user not visiting Queenzone.com

Bohemian: 710 posts
add to buddy list send PM

Posted: 17 Dec 06, 17:05 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

masterstroke_84 wrote:

Yes I Do... but comparing to KISS records... LK is less full of overdubs... I have 4 or 5 boots of ´79 and the overdubs of LK are very tinny... in the case of Alive 3 and 4... those records were mostky recorded in the studio more than in a gig :S...

You didn´t get the point...

P.


Again, talking out of your ass.

I have a bootleg of "Alive IV - KISS Symphony". The only overdub was Gene's vocals on "Great Expectations", because it didn't come out great. That was the first and only time they've played that song live.


"Every night's a party at Melina's mansion!"
Penetration_Guru user not visiting Queenzone.com
Penetration_Guru
Deity: 11013 posts
add to buddy list send PM

Posted: 17 Dec 06, 17:10 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

<font color=#FFFFFF>The Invisible Man wrote:

Hello everybody!

Just thought it would be interesting to compare both KISS and Queen concerts. After all, I think it is fair to say they're both the greatest stadium rockers.

I look forward to everybodies opinions and or facts.

Steve


AC/DC, The Stones and even Metallica could be considered...if you take your "these are my favourite bands so let's just talk about them" blinkers off.

maxpower user not visiting Queenzone.com
maxpower
Bohemian: 477 posts
add to buddy list send PM

Posted: 17 Dec 06, 18:51 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

Kiss were/are the most overated band in rock history even their "destroyer" claimed as their best is shit, the 1st track detroit rock city is shit & it just gets worse for me Aerosmith kick their ass in ref to american rock banks starting out in 1970's.


I just cant handle that bollocks at all, these days im listening to more punk than ever, only today bought the Clash's singles box set lovely presentation

jpf user not visiting Queenzone.com

Bohemian: 710 posts
add to buddy list send PM

Posted: 17 Dec 06, 19:47 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

maxpower wrote:

Kiss were/are the most overated band in rock history even their "destroyer" claimed as their best is shit, the 1st track detroit rock city is shit & it just gets worse for me Aerosmith kick their ass in ref to american rock banks starting out in 1970's.


Aeroshit blows.

maxpower wrote:


I just cant handle that bollocks at all, these days im listening to more punk than ever, only today bought the Clash's singles box set lovely presentation


Figures. Punk == talentless fashion posers.


"Every night's a party at Melina's mansion!"
masterstroke_84 user not visiting Queenzone.com

Bohemian: 542 posts
add to buddy list send PM

Posted: 17 Dec 06, 19:51 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

seems like no-one can have an opinion because individuals like jpf insult you...

maybe I´m wrong... but you have to learn not to insult every person who have a different opinion...

Bye.


Queen rocks!
jpf user not visiting Queenzone.com

Bohemian: 710 posts
add to buddy list send PM

Posted: 17 Dec 06, 20:34 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

masterstroke_84 wrote:

seems like no-one can have an opinion because individuals like jpf insult you...

maybe I´m wrong... but you have to learn not to insult every person who have a different opinion...

Bye.


When I state that Aeroshit and Punk suck, that's my opinion.

When I state that Queen "Live Killers" was a cut and paste job, that's fact.


"Every night's a party at Melina's mansion!"
bobo the chimp user not visiting Queenzone.com
bobo the chimp
Deity: 12703 posts
add to buddy list send PM

Posted: 17 Dec 06, 21:39 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

"seems like no-one can have an opinion because individuals like jpf insult you..."

Ordinarily I'd agree with you, but he was right about punk.

"How the hell do you overdub a live concert?
You're really talking out of your ass."

Ugh....

http://img294.imageshack.us/img294/6404/whagz2.jpg

Look. Once it's recorded, it's not a live concert anymore. It's a recording - same as any other one. It just happened to be recorded on a stage, dude.

Jesus!


"Your not funny, your not a good musician, theres a difference between being funny and being an idiot, you obviously being the latter" - Dave R Fuller
jpf user not visiting Queenzone.com

Bohemian: 710 posts
add to buddy list send PM

Posted: 17 Dec 06, 21:48 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

Zebonka12 wrote:


"How the hell do you overdub a live concert?
You're really talking out of your ass."

Ugh....

Look. Once it's recorded, it's not a live concert anymore. It's a recording - same as any other one. It just happened to be recorded on a stage, dude.


The person that I was responding to stated that KISS overdubbed when they were performing live in concert. I took that to mean that he was saying KISS were lip synching in concert, which is totally not true.


"Every night's a party at Melina's mansion!"
Wiley user not visiting Queenzone.com

Royalty: 1704 posts
add to buddy list send PM

Posted: 17 Dec 06, 22:01 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

Hey.. well, about other bands that put up good shows I see PG brought up Metallica. I saw them in 1999 in Mexico City but I was on the benches, a bit far from the stage. Still I thought it was a very energetic and powerful show; the flames at the beginning of "Fuel" were printed deeply within my brain as I remember it almost made me jump off my seat, hehe :). Haven't seen AC/DC live, although I would like to do so.

Another good show, but in a more "theatrical" fashion, was Marilyn Manson. I enjoy some of his songs but I've never bought an album. Saw him around 2003-2004 and it was a very visual and entertaining show.

Check out U2's Zooropa Live from Sydney DVD for another larger than life spectacle. I think it was a very cool concept for that time and a great homage for the MTV/media generation, hehe :).

Wiley

dorahc user not visiting Queenzone.com

Bohemian: 107 posts
add to buddy list send PM

Posted: 17 Dec 06, 23:21 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

I've seen KISS numerous times and only Queen once. I think it's unfornuate that Queen had such a bad promotion when it came to the States.

Kiss was promoted and that helped with their merchandising and career. Queen was also promoted, but it seems only in England.

They are both good. KISS has a fantastic stage show, with pyros and all. Queen also had a good stage show and that stage show was FREDDIE!

Still I like both.

NOTWMEDDLE user not visiting Queenzone.com
NOTWMEDDLE
Bohemian: 691 posts
add to buddy list send PM

Posted: 18 Dec 06, 02:45 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

jpf wrote:

masterstroke_84 wrote:

KISS concerts are FULL... FULL of overdubs...


How the hell do you overdub a live concert?
You're really talking out of your ass.

As far as the original question goes ...

There's KISS in concert, then there's everyone else. Queen, visually, was good. KISS wrote the book on the concert experience.

masterstroke_84 wrote:

and practically the whole KISS live albums are overdubs... the only way that you can compare is listening to some bootleg...


Queen "Live Killers" was all cut and paste. There are lines from one city intermixed with lines from other cities in a single track. If you listen carefully you can hear where the edits are.

KISS released Instant Live recordings from almost all of the shows on their "Rock The Nation" tour in 2004. I received my copy 20 minutes after the concert finished. No overdubs, just a great concert souvenir.

masterstroke_84 wrote:

Queen were better live... because they not only put a hell of a show, but also have great musical perfomances... I think KISS only have a great visual show but not a great music show... Queen were awesome in both aspects.


Sounds like you've never attended a KISS concert.

Listen to Queen's Hyde Park show. Freddie was terrible.


Alive! was overdubbed in the recording studio. There were many overdubs save the drums. Alive was chock full of overdubs. Deep Purple's Made in Japan, made a few years earlier, had NO OVERDUBS! KISS Instant Live CDs didn't last long as they were burned CDs of shows. They deteriorated after a short time.

For the record, I have attended four KISS concerts. The first one which was 1996 I didn't really get to enjoy cos of three of the eight people I went with (my two older brothers and my brother's friend) were either drunk or high or confrontational and took the starch out cos I had to hold my drunk second older brother up on his feet and then wound up fighting with him and my other older brother cos some drunk made fun of my clothing choice (Nike Cortez, Docker shorts, BIG WOW!). 1998 was better and the best of four KISS shows I saw IMHO and went with different group of people and no fights this go around. 2000 was not as enjoyable as older brother and his friend were complaining about beer prices. Admittedly, seeing Peter Criss play triggered drums on the post-1980 stuff was a laugh and the band didn't have the same energy they had on the 1998 tour. Then 2004 was not the same and majority of people who went to show I went to left before KISS took stage. I didn't like seeing doppleganger Peter and doppleganger Ace personally and there were certain parts of show where I did nod off. I enjoyed the 70s KISS concerts moreso.

Editing live records in the 1970s was more primitive than today. With today's technology you can record many shows and replace bad notes from one show with a better performance from another with a click of the mouse. That was how Pink Floyd's PULSE album was done. The band recorded all of the European leg of their 1994 tour and none of the band was around for the mixing as David Gilmour and his wife had a child so he was mainly at home with his wife and kids but popped in to approve what songs and performances to go on the album. Nick Mason was off auto racing somewhere and Rick Wright was sailing somewheres. Even PULSE co-producer/engineer and long time PF associate James Guthrie stated no one came in to re-record anything and bad notes were replaced with notes from other shows. Technology has changed since the 1970s for the better.

Even pro-tools fixed Freddie's voice on Fat Bottomed Girls on On Fire at the Bowl.

Aerosmith suck balls. They died in 2001 with that Super Bowl fiasco they did with B*tchn*y Sneers, N'S*ck, Hairy Mary J unoBliged and smelly Nelly.

Rush is superb l


"Spread your wings and fly away, fly away, far away!", "No one makes me sing lullabies and no one makes me close my eyes"
Sebastian user not visiting Queenzone.com
Sebastian
Deity: 6327 posts
add to buddy list send PM

Posted: 18 Dec 06, 06:11 Edit this post Reply to this post Reply with Quote

As much as I tend to prefer Kiss, especially for a live setting (because of the songs, not the actual band), I think Queen (during the 70s) were better: shows were both visual and musical, and indeed the songs were far more complex so it's a plus too.

Even if Brian wasn't half as good live as he was in the studio, he was much more versatile than any guitarist Kiss have ever had: have you noticed that Ace, good as he was/is, always plays the same bloody thing?


John hated HS. Fred's fave singer was not PR. Roger didn't compose 'Innuendo.' Witness testimonies are often inaccurate. Scotland's not in England. 'Bo Rhap' hasn't got 180 voices.